E-tolling or E Thief?

[Citizen X]

My brother inlaw sent me an email today which included an attachment(A letter from Botha Attorneys) regarding the etolling debacle. Makes for very interesting reading! Botha Attorneys: I hold you in high regard!!!!See attached
Yesterday, I used 2 higways during peak traffic, the M1 south and the M1 North. The traffic is far worse as far as I'm concerned. There's been next to know development on these 2 highways. The only noticeable additions are the Sanrail structures to etoll you. I also did not have extra time for the gym, nor did I have extra time for my family and I most certainly did not make any money whatsoever. As more road users enter our roads, traffic will only get worse and worse, it will never improve...

[IanF]

Vanash
I heard that Sanral have agreed to change their terms to be in line with the consumer protection act. But these have not yet been published. Aren't Sanral just following big business with totally one sided contracts, that is why government has stepped in with consumer protection act.
Anyway I have no intention of registering. Terms like this scare the sh1t out of 11.

The registered motorist further agrees that failure to make payment in respect of an E-Toll transaction in terms of the terms & conditions may result in criminal proceedings against themselves.

This with the totally unreasonable power hikes and petrol hikes is making SA become just another failed African country.
My feeling is that this will be scrapped or the tolls reduced to a 10c per KM basis, the management in SANRAL must be changed to public servants who serve the public and not corporate executives who are try to scr3w us.

[Citizen X]

Ian,
I think we've reached a tragic stage in our history. The message by government and Sanrall is clear: Pay or else! I agree that petrol, electricity and various other commodities have seen major price hikes. My concern is for the working mom and dad that have a budget that barely balances. Their employers are not going to give them an increase in line with inflation and other short term financial strains. On first glance it does indeed appear that Sanrall are following big business with one sided contracts. The main difference is other creditors don’t have law enforcement capabilities. You have a bond with XYZ bank, you pay diligently but suddenly you unable to pay. XYZ follows the typical legal route debt collection and summons respectively but XYZ bank don’t have law enforcement abilities. A creditor should never be granted with law enforcement powers. It's noteworthy that etolling only applies to us Gauteng...
In principal I’m for the paying of tolls for the maintenance and improvement of our roads. We all realize that quality roads make for a safer journey, we all realize that potholes are intolerable. My gripe is simply this: The amount they want per kilometer is unreasonable. If it’s about recovering the monies spent on this project, make a flat rate of R50 per month for all road users. Eventually they will recover this expenditure and also make a profit. I have not done any qualitative or quantitative research on attitudes of South Africans but my primary purpose as an evangelist takes me to many informal settlements and the vast majority of Black individuals I come into contact with tell me that they have simply had enough of the ANC, that they have lost confidence in the ANC and perhaps more importantly, they not actually even concerned with the national or provincial spheres of government but rather the local level. They provide that not only is service delivery at an all time low but that they treated very badly by the local city council, the local clinic, the home affairs department. The vast majority of individuals that I have spoken to in the informal settlements make it very clear that they not fools and will not vote for the ANC ever again. So whenever that nurse at the local clinic treats someone without dignity and respect they simply tell themselves this nurse is the ANC. I am not going to vote for the ANC again!!! I was a die hard supporter of the ANC(not member, I hold no political party membership), but I can tell you just as clear as night follows day I will never vote for the ANC ever again!!!!!
On the other hand we’ve reached a positive stage in our history where several interest groups who otherwise would not be unified on a single issue now share the same contempt for Sanral i.e. DA, COSATU and AFRIFORUM. We have Sanrall to thank for this positive development. I figure that the days of voting for a party on the mere basis of being the same racial group is slowly but surely changing i.e If there’sa party ABC who has a majority of Indian members but are riddled with corruption, maladministration and reverse racism, I’m certainly not going to vote for them on the arbitrary and frivolous ground that I am also Indian so for that reason I must simply vote for the them NO!!My comments that many Black individuals that I have personally come across choose not to vote for the ANC simply because they are the liberation party and have a predominant Black politician membership should be view in this context.

[MGM]

"or maybe improving the relationships with the rest of your family".

Sounds like the doctor's got family issues.

[murdock]

how are they going to manage the motorcycles...number plate on the back and sometimes small

[Citizen X]

Murdock, there are so many unanswered questions. I have alot of good friends in the tow truck business. I wonder how etolling will affect them.....

[IanF]

Vanash,
Politics is a dirty business and my view always vote for the opposition so that one party does not have the unfettered power that the ANC has now. Lets hope this anger spills over to the elections.

[Citizen X]

Ian,
Your view has merit! We need a strong opposition. No South Africa should contend with corruption, nepotism, maladministration and this general notion that person who hold prominent political oppostions are absolute. They not. They subject to the rule of law. I'm awaiting the next election with much anticipation. I really want to see what impact poor service delivery, nepotism, corruption and maladministartion will have on the seats the ANC gets in Parliament. I watched Carte Blanche with great interest this Sunday. You have a sitting crime intelligence boss who has many allegations and unanswered questions hanging over him i.e. why was charges dropped alternatively why did the NPA not prosecute. According to Carte Blanche, this so called slush/secret fund that should be used for bona fide crime intelligence work is paying salaries to several of the crime intelligence bosses family members. The only thing that qualified them to be covert crime intelligence agents is the fact that they family of the crime boss. How can everyone just let this go? Surely, there's a job description and specification for covert operatives. I cannot accept that the crime bosses family had the appropriate training, experience and qualifications to hold such position. Ther are many police officers and security personnel who would be far more competent than the crime bosses family. South Africans of all race groups are indignant of this.

[AndyD]

19. By registering for an E Tag account the onus is placed on the motorist to change the motor vehicle details linked to the E Toll account when you lose possession of the vehicle or where ownership in respect of the vehicle is transferred to a third party. Failure to do so will mean that the motorist will remain liable for any E-Toll charges incurred.

I can see this going the way of the TV licences.....the Hotel California of administrative systems.....
'We are programmed to receive.
You can check-out any time you like,
But you can never leave'

I'm also predicting a logrithmic increase in licence plate cloning.

Being in Cape Town I can just sit back and watch the fun and games.....for now at least. Don't get me wrong I wouldn't have a problem with subsidising the roads if it was sensible figures and done through a petrol tax but this system is flawed from the ground up, it's just farcical. Even Cape Town isn't exactly wine and roses with toll roads, the Chapmans Peak / Entilini debacle (probably the most expensive toll road in the southern hemisphere on a Rand/Km basis) costs me 10-15 minutes some evenings on the way home having to go the long route around.

[murdock]

i believe it is just the start...once this is lauched in jhb...it will be affecting everyone sooner than you think...and you thought paying over R12 a litre for petrol was bad...and i thought that mad max film was just a movie...could it become a reality in my life time...seen a lot of changes TV...computers...internet...cellphones...i could even still be around to see the world war over water.

[Nickolai Naydenov]

Botha Attorneys

Attorneys at Law/Prokureurs
*

Specializing in Corporate Debt Recovery
*56A Shortmarket Street, Newlands, Johannesburg, 2092.* P.O. Box/Posbus 508, Newtown, 2113
*Tel:* 087 830 2255* Fax/Faks:011 477 0615
*DX 281, JHB
*E-mail: deon@bothaattorneys.co.za
*Deon Botha (B.Jur LLB)
*
Our Ref:**************** D. Botha/jb/
Your Ref:************** *
11th April 2012

E-TOLLING – GENERAL COMMENTS

This communication is not a legal opinion in any way whatsoever and only forwarded to yourselves for comment and for further discussion.
*
As you are all aware, motorist in Gauteng will be paying “toll fees” for the use of the new upgraded Gauteng freeways, to fund the Gauteng freeway development project.
*
Instead of motorist being billed monthly and receiving a statement for the usage of the E-Toll roads and which usage is linked to your motor vehicle license plate number (VLN), Sanral is currently pushing and encouraging motorist to rather purchase an E-Tag and to register as an E-Tag user, or to register as a VLN user.
In return for purchasing and registering as a E-Tag user / VLN user they promise that motorists may then qualify and be entitled to discounts, be categorized as either a E-Tag user or a registered VLN user to be entitled to discounted tolls.* Should you elect not to register with Sanral, you will however not be entitled to any discounts or lower tariffs.

At first glace and when comparing the normal toll rates, to that of the discounted toll rates when you elect to register, the normal and reasonable uninformed motorist would be guided only by the discounts when signing up for registration.

After perusal of Sanral Terms & Conditions however, and which must be signed prior to registration, you will immediately note that the advantages of registering as an E-Toll user is very limited and comes with various onerous and one sided terms and obligations favoring only Sanral.* Many clauses in their terms and conditions are being viewed by ourselves as well as other institutions as being either unlawful or in contravention of the Consumer Protection Act.*

DISADVANTAGES FOR MOTORISTS WHO ELECT TO REGISTER AS AN E-TAG OR VLN USER

1.**************** The discounts promised, and categorization as a registered E Tag user will not apply to all toll roads.

2.**************** The onus is placed on the registered E-Toll user to establish their user categorization and/or the tolls applicable to a specific E-Toll road.* The motorist can obtain the information from Sanral website.
3.**************** A motorist who registers and thereafter fails to comply with any of Sanral’s prescribed terms and conditions, will be deemed to be an E-Road violator and their account can be referred to a collection agency called “Violations Processing Centre” which is a division of Sanral itself. (See paragraph 2 of Sanral terms & conditions).*

4.**************** Motorist who register will be billed and will be liable for toll transactions recorded according to the user VLN or E-Tag.

5.**************** Motorist who register agree and understand that their liability to incur toll when the motor vehicle passes a tolling point and that the amount of toll is calculated with reference to the tolling point and not with reference to the KM traveled before the user reaches the tolling point.

6.**************** Motorist who register are given 3 payment options for topping up their E Toll accounts namely, Pre-Paid Accounts, Manual Top Up Payments, Automatic Top Up Payments, all associated with the risk taking into account that you are contracting with a wholly owned State Company where corruption is at the order of the day.

7.**************** Motorists who register further agrees and undertakes to ensure at all times that there is sufficient funds in the E-Toll account and should you fail to make sufficient payments into your E-Toll account will give Sanral the right to hand over your account to VPC for collection purposes.

8.**************** Motorists who register and who elect to link their E-Toll account to a credit card bank account, debit card further authorizes Sanral to:
*********** a.**** debit the motorists account to fund the E-Toll account for Toll fees incurred when raised;
*********** b.**** undertakes to ensure that sufficient funds are available in the account;
*********** c.***** places the duty on the motorist to notify Sanral of bank account detail changes.
*
9.**************** A registered motorist undertakes and agrees to settle all E-Toll transactions within any period required by Sanral.
10.*********** Should the registered motorist fail to make payments when required to do so, Sanral will have the right without notice to the motorists to suspend the motorist account, to red list the E-Tag and to hand the account over for collection to VPC.

11.*********** The registered motorist further agrees that failure to make payment in respect of an E-Toll transaction in terms of the terms & conditions may result in criminal proceedings against themselves.

12.*********** By registering the motorist agrees and understands that a statement of charges will be available on the E-Toll website for download and that should hardcopies be requested, that Sanral will have the right to charge for furnishing such copies.

13.*********** Registered motorists agree that any payment made to Sanral will be utilized against the oldest charge to the most recent.

14.*********** Registered motorist E-Toll account will be suspended if not used for a period of 12 months and will have to be reactivated. (at a charge).

15.*********** Registered motorist agrees further that Sanral will not be held responsible for any loss or damage a motorist may suffer as a result of incorrect banking details being provided by the user and captured by Sanral except for instances where Sanral or its agent acted with gross negligence.

16.*********** Registered motorists agree to be liable for additional fees and attorney charges which may be incurred by Sanral in the collection of outstanding E-Toll amounts.

17.*********** Registered motorists further consent to the onerous provision that it will be deemed that the fees charged by Sanral are correct and the onus is placed on the motorist to prove that such charges are incorrect.

18.*********** Registered motorists will not be provided with a receipt when they proceed through the tolling point.* A tax invoice may however be requested but then at the expense of the motorist.

19.*********** By registering for an E Tag account the onus is placed on the motorist to change the motor vehicle details linked to the E Toll account when you lose possession of the vehicle or where ownership in respect of the vehicle is transferred to a third party.* Failure to do so will mean that the motorist will remain liable for any E-Toll charges incurred.

20.*********** By registering the motorist acknowledges and accepts that by purchasing an E Tag and registering same does not in itself necessary result in a valid passage on an E Toll Road and that you may be prevented by Sanral to continue driving on the E Road.

21.*********** By registering, the motorist agrees and accepts that Sanral will be entitled and without notice to the motorist to suspend an E Toll account and to Red List an E Tag, for failure of any of Sanral terms & conditions.* Should the motorist later prove that there was no transgression of Sanral terms & conditions, they will have no claim against Sanral as in terms of the agreement such claims are waived by the motorist in favor of Sanral.

22.*********** Whilst ownership in the E Tag and E Tag holder remains the property of Sanral the risk of loss, theft or damage passes to you upon delivery.

23.*********** By registering, the motorist irrevocably authorizes Sanral or its duly authorized agents to obtain from any institutions where they may have an account or any credit bureau any information concerning themselves.

24.*********** By registering the motorist further acknowledge and accepts that Sanral may unilaterally update and amend their terms & conditions and that the motorist has consented to such amendments and has agreed to abide by such amended terms & conditions.*

25.*********** By registering for an E Tag, the motorist is affording Sanral a blanket indemnity for any wrong doing, loss or damage that the motorist may have suffered by using the E road.

26.*********** A registered motorist further agrees to an unlawful provision in consenting to the jurisdiction of the Magistrate’s Court of Pretoria in respect of all matters arising out of the terms & conditions.

A copy of Sanral terms and conditions is attached hereto for your ease of reference.

ADVANTAGES FOR MOTORIST WHO ELECTS NOT TO REGISTER AND RATHER PAY THE NORMAL TOLL RATE TARIFFS
1.**************** Motorist will be billed for the use of the E Toll, without automatically being liable for such use, in the event of receiving incorrect readings from Sanral, theft, cloning of number plates, or the cloning of a motorist personal information etc

2.**************** The onus will be on Sanral to prove that it was the motorist’s vehicle that traveled the recorded distances.

3.**************** Payments will be made and effected by the motorist into a Sanral bank account.

4.**************** Sanral’s collection division (VPC) will have no jurisdiction over non registered motorists.

5.**************** Motorists will be entitled to monthly statements without any charge.

6.**************** Motorists would be entitled to dictate how payments be allocated in respect of Toll road usage.

7.**************** Motorists who do not register would not automatically be liable for additional fees or attorney charges.

8.**************** The onus remains on Sanral to prove that the fees charged and for which the motorist is debited are correct.

9.**************** Until an exemption notice is published motorist will be entitled to a receipt when paying for E Toll road usage.

10.*********** In the event of a dispute with Sanral regarding outstanding charges, Sanral will not have the right to prevent the non registered motorist from continued use of the E Toll road.
*
11.*********** Losses suffered by non registered motorist can be recovered by way of civil action.
12.*********** Sanral will not have the right to have access to any private information of a non registered motorist.

13.*********** Sanral will not have the right to amend any terms & conditions without the motorist agreeing to such amendments.

14.*********** In the event of litigation, Sanral will have to issue a civil Summons or proceed criminally against the motorist in terms of the Criminal Procedure Act and will be forced to litigate against the motorist in a Magistrate’s Court who has jurisdiction over that motorist. (It is unlawful to consent to the jurisdiction of a specific Magistrate’s Court).


The above comment is made and must be read in conjunction with various sections of the National Credit Act, and the Consumer Protection Act.* Should you have any further queries please do not hesitate to contact writer hereof.

[Citizen X]

"You can check-out any time you like,
But you can never leave"

Tragic, tragic, tragic, but you exactly right. Our relationship with Sanrall will be till death do us part(or will , do you reckon they'll sue your deceased estate??)

[Citizen X]

I would sincerely like to know how Sanrall’s etolling will marginalize certain categories of people: Pensioners(Pensioner get R1200 per month: Are they now precluded from using the highways on the basis that they poor? I submit that pensioners should be exempt); Unemployed people: We have a high rate of unemployment in South Africa. A person may be unemployed for several reasons, retrenchment, liquidation of the company they worked for, dismissal, unemployed due to illness( I submit that these people should be exempt from etolling.

[IanF]

This saga gets more interesting. With COSATU apparently pulling the strings on this and getting a delay. How will this end I reckon a dedicated fuel levy in Gauteng!

[Citizen X]

Good morning Ian,
1. I'm personally happy with a reasonable fuel levy or a flat rate of R50 per month for every Gauteng road user. If they claiming that money will be recovered, collecting R50 per month from every single Gauteng road user will achieve this. They may not get their money over night but they will eventually get it!
I know alot of government pensioners in and around my neigbourhood who are literally terrified of a prospect where you can't use certain roads because you can't afford it...You've worked all your live, you now in your 70's. You do have a car, because you've paid it off during your working life, you now in a predicament where you only have R1200 at your disposal. Paying for petrol is bad enough and now you have to contend with etolling!
1. Firstly I’m aware that the rights in the bill of rights are limited in terms of section 36 of The Constitution of 1996;
2. That being said etolling will marginalize certain people i.e pensioners and unemployed people who also have the followings Constitutions Rights,
3. Every citizen has a right to freedom of movement and residence: This right will be infringed by etolling especially in a case where a person can’t afford it-
"21 Freedom of movement and residence
(1) Everyone has the right to freedom of movement.
(2) Everyone has the right to leave the Republic.
(3) Every citizen has the right to enter, to remain in and to reside anywhere in, the Republic.
(4) Every citizen has the right to a passport."