Violence in our schools

[pmbguy]

I actually hold great respect for Vanash and him posting quotations of the law is not entirely out of place he is after all a lawyer and he wanted to put his point across by quoting how the law views the matter. I simply wanted to point out that we are not ignorant of the law as HR pointed out.

I don’t feel that we must ever see the law as being infallible or even correct. After all the constitution is still just a document.

[adrianh]

The law...is a joke...

They make it up as they go along and they apply it when and how it pleases them.

[Justloadit]

Has anyone seen how large a law book is, or how many pages written with laws, in fact how many laws have been promulgated.

Heck I reckon that just getting out of bed in the morning, and you probably have contravened some law or other. There are so many laws already, and yet they promulgate more laws ona regular basis, and yet they can not even enforce the already promulgated laws.

Promulgating more laws is not going to make a society a better place, education and discipline will.
Humanity has been doing pretty well up to now, we have managed to survive the dark ages, renaissance and the new world, using the old Roman laws, now we must regulate every single aspect of our lives with a law, then pat ourselves on our backs, and saying how educated we are, let's make another law, just so that we think we are going to evolve and be more educated.

In times not so distance, a handshake was a binding contract, today we need to sign 500 page contracts, and then use the law to get out of the contract, and we call ourselves better to day because of the laws promulgated. I think that we are complicating life too much.

Next our children will be bulling the parents, and then we will need to promulgate another law, that children must not beat their parents or some other action.......

[adrianh]

No law can protect people from their own stupidity.

[Citizen X]

Vanash , as pmb says most of us are aware of the law, therefore you do not need to copy paste long drawn out scripts, which are still open for "argument"

Firstly I'll take the liberty of deciding what I do state in a thread or omit to state in a thread(Not taking instructions from you here)

Correction!!!! This matter in terms of the court and law is open for no discussion whatsoever. Yes, in this thread we may express our opinion.

HR Solutions, I most certainly don't want to copy and paste what I have previously stated in this thread, had you read what I had to say, there would then have been no logical need to copy and paste anything from what is otherwise a very lenghty judgment.

Just making my point, nothing wrong there.
Most of my posts on this thread focused on the actual problem of violence in our schools and my opinion of how this violence needs to be dealt with.
I’ve maintained that an integrated approach is required.
So, from a perspective of fairness, please enlighten me as to how I ‘copied, cut and paste,’ so much of my actual opinions on this matter.

[Citizen X]

In my official capacity as layman, my concluding opinion on violence in schools and disciplining children is simply this. It’s common cause that it’s a non- legal issue and post 1994 legislation was promulgated to prohibit corporal punishment.
My further point is that whatever argument, stance, opinion you may have on this matter, and yes, we all entitled to our opinions, you will find your stance or opinion or view or objection somewhere in this judgment and you will receive a comprehensive and well structured response from several of the Constitutional Court Judges who heard this matter and put their findings into writing for whomsoever to see.

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[1]http://www.saflii.org/za/cases/ZACC/2000/11.html.

[Citizen X]

‘res ipsa loquitur.’

[HR Solutions]

I'm not sure why you feel it necessary to BOLD everything .... It really comes across as shouting ..... !

[Citizen X]

I'm not sure why you feel it necessary to BOLD everything .... It really comes across as shouting ..... !

I hate to point out the obvious to you, but less than 1% of my posts in this specific thread are in bold(So the conclusion you draw is flawed and has no factual basis whatsoever)!!

Furthermore I have a profound respect for the rules of TFSA, as such, should any moderator or management of TFSA call me to order on any thread, I will gladly comply! You needn't concern yourself too much as to why I would decide to place a certain word(s) in bold, it's my prerogative!

That said, not shouting at anyone, merely making a point

[tec0]

In retrospect I would say a punishment must be fitting. I don’t see how a “snot klap” can solve violence in school. If the people is armed and is willing to take a life then obviously normal discipline will have no effect. This person made a choice and is willing and able to take a life for what reason I leave to speculation.

I say again if you are willing to hurt a child then that is a sickness it is not “discipline”. Discipline is easy to introduce and easy to maintain. Access control, and proper security cameras will do much more to keep students inline because their actions can and will be used against them by law.

This will protect the good student and the bad one can deal with the cops and the many laws that govern this country. We are not dealing with "there homework wasn't done type of problems" You are dealing with someone that is ready to take a human life. Clearly it is not the same thing.

As stated before:

facts speak for themselves

[HR Solutions]

Perhaps if some kids had a "snot klap" by their parents on their way up between the age's of 5-16 they wouldn't act like imbeciles at school !

[Justloadit]

Discipline must be instilled from a very young age, and that is when a snot klap is effective. In my case it took only a couple of them to get my kids to understand that there is a time to play, and a time to behave. Waiting for the kids to reach 16 with a free reign, and then attempting to instill discipline is where the problem lies. The damage of ill discipline has already been ingrained.

How many times have you seen very young kids having a fit in a public place because mommy/daddy does not wish to allow the kid to have what he/she wants. Now I am not saying that the parents must klap the kids in public to make their point, the way to do it is when the you get home, that's when you instil the discipline. The next time they do in public, one simply mentions the action of the time before, and immediately the discipline kicks in.

When I was a kid, my mother simply gave me a skeef look, and I already knew that I have over stepped my boundary. During my upbringing I got a few deservedly good hidings, but I was never beaten up for the sake of it. With today's laws, this would be seen as an assault.

[Citizen X]

How many times have you seen very young kids having a fit in a public place because mommy/daddy does not wish to allow the kid to have what he/she wants.

Many times in various malls. Kids are generally very demanding today. There is a lack of discipline and respect. The best interest of the child is the point of departure(This best interest definately includes being free from inhuman, violent and degrading treatment). The very fabric of our moral and ethical structure of SA society needs to change

[pmbguy]

I like to refer to children as drunk midgets. Because they look and behave just like drunk midgets

[tec0]

Discipline must be instilled from a very young age, and that is when a snot klap is effective. In my case it took only a couple of them to get my kids to understand that there is a time to play, and a time to behave. Waiting for the kids to reach 16 with a free reign, and then attempting to instill discipline is where the problem lies. The damage of ill discipline has already been ingrained.

How many times have you seen very young kids having a fit in a public place because mommy/daddy does not wish to allow the kid to have what he/she wants. Now I am not saying that the parents must klap the kids in public to make their point, the way to do it is when the you get home, that's when you instil the discipline. The next time they do in public, one simply mentions the action of the time before, and immediately the discipline kicks in.

When I was a kid, my mother simply gave me a skeef look, and I already knew that I have over stepped my boundary. During my upbringing I got a few deservedly good hidings, but I was never beaten up for the sake of it. With today's laws, this would be seen as an assault.

This is difficult to talk about because I use to be a “parent/guardian” I took the time to understand the child there reasoning and their behaviour. Then carefully I introduced manners, discipline and manipulated there thinking to the point where they behave because “they see themselves”

I gave them value and a profound sense Honour dignity and integrity. Today they want to succeed and they do... I am proud to say