HOW NOT TO PAY E TOLL !!!!

[Hermes14]

This ANother Crook mob are thick.

Instead of ploughing money into decent mass transport, they choose to squeeze the remaining transport conduits for blood. Causing inflation, resentment & adding nails to the economy's coffin.

Is it possible to train the current bus & taxi drivers to like human beings & look after the transport they are driving?

[desA]

Is it possible to train the current bus & taxi drivers to like human beings & look after the transport they are driving?

Mass transit systems do not require many humans.

Singapore

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_Rapid_Transit_%28Singapore%29

Thailand

http://www.bts.co.th/index_coverPage.html

Malaysia (Kuala Lumpur)

http://www.kiat.net/malaysia/KL/transit.html

[Hermes14]

Mass transit systems do not require many humans.

Singapore

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_Rapid_Transit_%28Singapore%29

Thailand

http://www.bts.co.th/index_coverPage.html

Malaysia (Kuala Lumpur)
http://www.kiat.net/malaysia/KL/transit.html

Just have a look at how the blacks set their own trains alight these days.
If South Africa decided to upgrade their metro rail system how long do you think it would last?

[desA]

[at]Hermes14:
There is always a way...

Some countries position soldiers on public assets of this nature, if under threat. They ensure that public property is protected, as well as ensuring the safety of other passengers.

SA needs a serious wake-up call, where some personal liberties may need to be sacrificed, in order to protect the greater common good. Once a culture of tolerance has been established, the authoritarian controls can be gradually relaxed. SA is not a normal society, by any means.

SA society has to get through these baby steps towards modernisation.

[Miro Bagrov]

@Miro who is this Dubai backer, I thought this was financed by bonds and the government pension fund was the main buyer of the bonds?

A multi-millionare, his identity was in the news on like page 3/4 in 2008 of Pretoria Business News. That was when the project was still being planned, and it was not front page interest like today.

In those days the government was hit with complaints of traffic on the N1 to Jhb. This guy made an offer to finance the upgrade project and invest in South Africa in that way. The government never had, nor ever made, any provision to the upgrade whatsoever. So they took his offer seriously.

This investment, and it's interest due, will be sitting in the liability section of Sanral's balance sheet. As you know, Sanral has been registered in such a way, that they never have to disclose their financial position on purpose. This financial position is very, very weak.

Along the way, the project made an offer to other investors who also bit the bullet. This was 2009 - 2010 time. I think they only accepted offers offers over 100 million to invest in the project.

This post's author said, if you don't pay, they will go bankrupt is a very true. They are technically not liquid, because they have no income. At this stage it is just a ponzi scheme using the money of the investors to pay them back. My guess is they can only cover another two years of interest payments, because they have spent the rest of the money.

Bottom line - they really will go bankrupt if no one pays. I don't think the government can afford to bail them.
But because of the magnitude of the investment, even the government at high levels is concerned about what to do. You can imagine how it looks from their perspective - "the SA government took my money, they said they will repay me with interest, and now they must protect my investment." Can you blame them?

[Justloadit]

Bottom line - they really will go bankrupt if no one pays. I don't think the government can afford to bail them.
But because of the magnitude of the investment, even the government at high levels is concerned about what to do. You can imagine how it looks from their perspective - "the SA government took my money, they said they will repay me with interest, and now they must protect my investment." Can you blame them?

and how many paws were greased along the way.

There is more than enough money in the fuel levy to take care of the bill, but they insist on selecting the most expensive way to collect money to repay the loan, why should this path be insisted on, when there are other simpler more cost effective ways.

[Didditmiself]

A multi-millionare, his identity was in the news on like page 3/4 in 2008 of Pretoria Business News. That was when the project was still being planned, and it was not front page interest like today.

In those days the government was hit with complaints of traffic on the N1 to Jhb. This guy made an offer to finance the upgrade project and invest in South Africa in that way.
But because of the magnitude of the investment, even the government at high levels is concerned about what to do. You can imagine how it looks from their perspective - "the SA government took my money, they said they will repay me with interest, and now they must protect my investment." Can you blame them?

I (like several others on TFSA) are under the impression that the money to finance this iniquitous system was borrowed from some Government Pension Scheme - not financed by just one individual. All along, we've been led to believe that the Govt has to repay the amount to the Pension Fund in order to avoid consequences. WTF?

[IanF]

Miro is this what you are referring to?

TOLL REVENUE SCAM

SANRAL has recently become aware of a scam relating to SANRAL toll roads and toll revenue. A certain individual has allegedly informed members of the public that he was facilitating a deal in terms of which he would obtain a portion of the N1 highway in Gauteng (between Malibongwe and Beyers Naude roads) from SANRAL. Members of the public were invited to invest money with this person for an attractive return. The return on investment would be based on a percentage of the toll revenue to be collected on that specific section of the national road.

SANRAL would like to categorically state that this scheme, or any other scheme of this nature, is fraudulent and there will never be any investment opportunities with respect to toll revenue collected on the national toll road network. SANRAL is not permitted to lease its roads to third parties.

The only investment opportunity available to potential investors on SANRAL toll roads is with regard to the bonds issued by SANRAL regularly, to fund its toll road network. This is done through our broker banks, ABSA and RMB.

A criminal case has been opened in this regard with the South African Police Services. The case number is Fairlands CAS 10/3/2011.

Link to sanral site

[Dave S]

and how many paws were greased along the way.

There is more than enough money in the fuel levy to take care of the bill, but they insist on selecting the most expensive way to collect money to repay the loan, why should this path be insisted on, when there are other simpler more cost effective ways.

The simpler, more cost effective ways are open to scrutiny and therefore the palms of certain individuals cannot be greased as easily, is my guess.

[Miro Bagrov]

Miro is this what you are referring to?

Link to sanral site

Hi Ian. I think this was a separate incident. I remember that this guy was taking people's money 'directly', and that was the fraud.

I agree, the investment product could be a bond, treasury notes, or debenture,or shares, or loan agreement, or anything they want to use as a binding agreement.
Even government bonds need to get their money from somewhere. And this was not small money.

The Pretoria News (and I don't believe that they will report without checking facts) announced the initial investor in the business report, in late 2008.

Do you think we can call Pretoria News and request they send their archived article to us? Not sure if that is something they do?

I added an analysis of their financial statements on the next reply..

[Miro Bagrov]

Analysis of SANRAL's Financial Statements

Here is the evidence:

Firstly:
Will SANRAL go bankrupt if no one pays? - Well the Auditor General THINKS SO in 2011!
He makes this note in the auditors report..



Next:
Does SANRAL make use of direct foreign investment? - YES, they say so themselves.

2008 - Sanral announces in it's reports that it has found direct foreign investment

Keep in mind that they are not required to disclose the identity of investors to who they owe money. They are only required to disclose the total amounts and the interest rates.

So from their financials, we will never know 'WHO BOUGHT THE BONDS". However, we can definitely see HOW MUCH they pay for them, and the CHANGE in total borrowings.


Let's look at the change in Long-Term Borrowings:

2008 Non-Current Liabilities	R12 568 932 000
2011 Non-Current Liabilities	R27 871 031 000
Increase over 3 years	R15 302 099 000

R15 302 099 000 is the amount of debt they piled up over 3 short years 2008 - 2011.


They are sitting with a European Bank Loan @ 8.62%



If there are huge investments, how much return on investment do they have to pay? - Answer - around 11%, according to their own financial statements.

Here is a breakdown of the returns on investment that they have to pay (2011):





Source:

http://www.nra.co.za/live/content.php?Item_ID=205

(Interesting to note that the 2012 file is corrupt, and 2013 is not available. It will be interesting to see what mess has been going on in those years.)

Our government is slowly descending into Hell - Driven by deficit, debt, foreign investment and corruption.

[IanF]

Hi Miro
here is a link to 2013 report
Nice analysis did you see any mention of a profit share? At least the audit report is not qualified.

I will try and look deeper when I have some spare time.

Still no news when this will be implemented.

[Dave S]

Still no news when this will be implemented.

My guess is 28th April 2014...?

[Justloadit]

Ha, just had my brother inform me of this one.

He has no choice but use the toll roads, he must travel round and round the ring road daily while doing his consulting business, and refuses to get an etag or even pay etolls, so you can imagine, his bill is quite hefty.

Anyway while at a client, his cellphone rings, and who do you think was on the other side?
Ha you guessed it, some one from etolls collecting division, so my boet tunes them "How did you get my number? are you aware this is a private number? I did not give you authority to call this number! and please do not call me again!", and hung up.

Whooweee what lengths are they going to go to to get payment?


Hold tight, the lack of payment is beginning to strangle them.