Good day, we have an electrical contractor who issues COC's with his very own COC number.
Apparently it is legal? My question is, if it is legal, what is the process to follow if you want to go this route?
What are the advantages of doing your own number system against buying printed forms with a number on it?
There is no data base or records for COC's, so why would you be concerned about a numbering system, so long as the contractor keeps records of COC's issued and the document has all the required information as laid out in the regs, I Can't see why you cannot create your own.
I have piles of old yellow 4 page COC, purchased many years ago, an updated copy of the new COC, I just use the number from the old COC to the new format. Once they are finished, I will probably make my own numbers.
In an ideal world, we would have a database where every every COC issued would be recorded and accessible to anyone working on the site.
Under definitions in the Electrical Installation Regulations 2009:Originally Posted by Tradie
"certificate of compliance" means -
a) a certificate with a unique number obtainable from the chief inspector, or a person appointed by the chief inspector, in the form of Annexure 1 J and issued by a registered person in respect of an electrical installation or part of an electrical installation; or
The "or" bit isn't relevant to the current issue of certificates - it is to deal with certificates issued prior to the 2009 regulations.
Participation is voluntary.
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I cannot understand why someone would use their own numbers, considering that the price of the coc booklets from ECA are so reasonable.
At least the ECA keeps record of which numbers are issued to which contractor should any future disputes arise.
You would think that because it is supposed to be a legal document, people would treat it as such.
Like a signed PDF, all COC's should have unique number be captured and stored for future reference by anyone with SP, IE, MIE, engineer status.
Random checks should be carried at least once a month and the registered person should be held accountable for errors or non compliance.
Every 5 years every registered person should be required to do a competency assessment in the field they are registered.
A number at the top of the page is least of our problems in this industry, but hey who's checking
Problem is that Chief inspector does not have such a data base and as far as I am aware has not appointed anybody the way I understand
We have self appointed organizations that have created data bases and would therefore see no reason to stop someone from creating there own database
Correct me if I am wrong.
With that said , Derlyn is correct , why go through the trouble of creating your own when ECA pricing is reasonable and especially the electronic format that keeps a record of each COC issued in it's complete format which we have used to go back and find and send a copy if needed.
Again I think it is members only which is why guys create there own electronic format
What has always been interesting is that ECA sells almost double the amount of COC's to non members then it does to members .
My theory is that there are double the amount of electrical contractors running around out there that are not members - I know it will be thrown back that ECA represents over 60% of contractors registered with NBCEI - I throw back that, that is dream land and the vast majority do not belong to NBCEI and therefore it would appear that ECA only represent 20% of people doing electrical contracting work.
For the record, I must say, a project I was involved in where a COC was issued with a few non compliant issues, was eventually sorted out with the help of a person appointed by the ECA.
Kudos to the ECA, for sorting it out. The only question now, will the member return to all the other installations they have completed and signed off and make them compliant, yes, we have identified another site which seems to have the same issues, but it is not one of my customers, so it is not my concern.
Back to unique numbers, lets try fix improve the industry by creating a register with unique numbers than works for EVERYONE in the industry.
GCE, I am all for improving this industry, even though it may not sound like it. I was a members of the ECA for more than 10 years, still have my certificate in my office, it looks like it is an old treasure map it is so old.
I believe we should find ways to make more small businesses want to join some form of association and be part of the bargaining council, maybe look at a turnover percentage to be paid for membership.
If only a very small percentage is registered with the ECA and bargaining council, maybe it is time to look at ways to address the challenges, identify the reason and align the ECA and bargaining council with the contractors, rather than trying to force an old system that clearly is not working.
You couldn't have a bus stop on a freeway in SA, we now have bus stops on freeways, would it benefit everyone, if 80 % of electrical contractors were members.
Electrical wholesaler could have a huge impact on the electrical industry, It's were we all get together and share stories or rant about the industry.
There are so many groups with 999 plus members just in the solar industry, imagine if people started utilising the groups in a positive manner.
The technology is available, its finding the right people to take the step.
None.
Being out here in the outback of civilization causes our unique problems, one of them is getting COC forms when you need them.
A 270km drive to the closest supplier of COC booklets do solve that problem, I on the other hand buy e-COC forms online, once you have paid for them you get them, no road trip needed to a supplier.
I have been dragged into a debate on the e-COC forms because the COC forms were not yellow and the number on the COC form were handwritten.
My main concern with a contractor issuing his own numbers is: "What happens in 5 years' time" Will the contractor still have record that he had issued the coc with that specific number? What if his laptop with numbers of the coc's issued get stolen or the hard drive crashes? What record does he then have on the coc numbers?
I'm glad to see the majority of contractors agree with me, the COC forms are so cheap, why bother creating your own form and serial number?
In a perfect world there would be a place where you could upload your COC into a National Database where an inspector can check every COC uploaded, and also for future reference it would be easy to get a copy of a coc issued when needed.
Enjoy your weekend
Greetings
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