DOL queries

[Isetech]

Lets say you end up in a situation where you have issued a COC and along comes Joe Soap from Sparkless sparkies incorporated, he tells the customer that the COC issued is not worth the paper it is written on. How would you as a small contractor, who is registered with the DOL find out if the code violations mentioned in the audit are valid.

Using the one mentioned on this platform as an example ,as it seems to be a common problem, earthing a light fitting/fan mounted higher than 2.5 m, we might all agree on this platform that if there is an earth terminal it should be earthed, but how do you get written confirmation from the DOL ?

Someone might say join the ECB or ECA, unfortunately the information would be same as the information shared on this platform, just someone's opinion.

To improve this industry there has to be a means for "all" registered electrical contractors to source valid factual information with regards to what is suppose to be a legal document (certificate of compliance), not just shared opinions.

As an electrical contractor I am sure you have heard other electrical contractors talk about the "grey" areas in the industry. How do we iron out this grey area ?

Open dialog directly with the people who control the system (DOL) would be a good start.

Maybe an email address for the technical adviser at the DOL, rather than a contact number because you would require the response in writing.

[GCE]

Someone might say join the ECB or ECA, unfortunately the information would be same as the information shared on this platform, just someone's opinion.

The ECA sits on Technical committees of SANS that decide what regulations will be changed or provide reasoning behind changing regs
An example will be the drive to align the gas regulations with the electrical regulations , or the addition of the note in 6.15 which I seem to recall coming from this forum during a discussion .
An opinion coming from ECA should hold some water as there is direct involment and understanding of why the regulation happened

Maybe an email address for the technical adviser at the DOL, rather than a contact number because you would require the response in writing.

Good luck with getting answers via email , it is a general struggle to get answers telephonically as the guys are short staffed amongst other obvious problems

[GCE]

Lets say you end up in a situation where you have issued a COC and along comes Joe Soap from Sparkless sparkies incorporated, he tells the customer that the COC issued is not worth the paper it is written on. How would you as a small contractor, who is registered with the DOL find out if the code violations mentioned in the audit are valid.

.

If you are a member of ECA you would have the backing or maybe better , the knowledge from committees that are actively involved in the regulations guiding you through the process and assisting in the interpretation of the regulations.

[Isetech]

I was a member of the ECA for more than 10 years, I still have my certificate with the date I registered in May 1991. I just couldn't justify the money spent on the membership. Not one of the outstanding debts owing to my company were ever recovered, a few free drinks once month to listen to the same tune playing every month at the meetings. Back in the days when Chris Greagor ran the show and Brian Bilton was the technical advisor, I could just see his eyes rolling back every time a call was put through to him and my name was mentioned.

If you are a company with 10 or more staff, then I would consider being a member. They should come up with a better incentive to encourage "small" electrical companies and sole props to join.

Good luck with getting answers via email , it is a general struggle to get answers telephonically as the guys are short staffed amongst other obvious problems

If that is the case, how would it even end up in court?

If the very people who control the industry cannot create awareness nor offer technical support, how on earth is an electrical contractor suppose to survive ?

What is the ratio of registered electrical contractors to ECA membership, 10 maybe 15 to 1 ?

It would be interesting to see the following stats.

Unregistered contractors operating in he industry.

DOL registered electrical contractors, with no affiliation to any association.

Electrical contractors registered with the ECA.

Electrical contractors registered with the ECB.

[GCE]

What is the ratio of registered electrical contractors to ECA membership, 10 maybe 15 to 1 ?

It is over 50% of contractors that belong to ECA and of that amount they employ around 80% of the workforce.

Dave may be able to give us more accurate numbers

[Isetech]

It is over 50% of contractors that belong to ECA and of that amount they employ around 80% of the workforce.

Dave may be able to give us more accurate numbers

Interesting, including all the one man operations?

Considering the business fail rate was almost 70 % within the first 5 years of start up, throw in 2 years of pandemic.

More than 50% of small electrical businesses in our area have closed down and the boss man has moved to another country.

I look forward to seeing some accurate stats.

[Dave A]

It is over 50% of contractors that belong to ECA and of that amount they employ around 80% of the workforce.

Dave may be able to give us more accurate numbers

I have KZN figures which are used to track representivity from NBCEI as at 25 January 2022 to hand.
59% of employers registered with NBCEI are members of the ECA (SA) and this represents 72% of the workforce.
Numbers exclude sole traders whether they are members of ECA (SA) or not.
Also note that not all employers are electrical contractors - there are a number of labour brokers in there (none of which are members of the ECA (SA)).

[skatingsparks]

Way I look at is this:-

There are things I don't like but they are things I can't fail because the sans 10142 books says its ok.

For example I don't like that I'm doing a COC on a building right now where the conduits are the only earth but as its an existing installation which hasn't changed and the readings are good - I can't fail it.

There are 3 kinds of electrical contractor COC's
1. The ones that aren't worth the paper they are written on
2. The ones that are done to the book.
3. The ones that are done to the own electricians and the books standards.

If you are 2 or 3 then you covered. Besides the COC is about state of the installation on the day you did it.

I got called out on a COC I did on my own work 4 years ago. There is now no incoming earth from municipality. It was there when I tested it- to the letter.
4 years on there is obviously a bad join some where before getting to the main switch. Is that my fault if something goes wrong? No.