Asking for your competitors quote to quote and better it?

[IanF]

There used to be a printer here who advertised in the yellow pages they would beat any written quote by 10%, next year it was any valid current quote by 7.5%. Now they are no longer around.
You have to convince customers that you offer a good service/product at a fair price. I remember when I started I was told any business you gain on price you will lose on price, that has been true. This morning I had someone come in for 3 different business cards double sided 100 each and was surprised when I told him it was over R1000 he was expecting R300. He said he will be back I doubt it.

[Justloadit]

I think that the heading of this thread is misleading. It depends on the product/service that one is seeking.

What we tend to forget, is the time it takes to make a quote, it costs money. Having someone do the work of a detailed quote, already has saved the next person many hours.

Let me site you another example, my brother is a air conditioning consultant, and was asked by one of the big boys, the yellow one, to design an air conditioning system to keep a container cool for rural areas, and that they required a couple of hundred units. They get the first one made, after all the problems were ironed out, and working to spec, wanted the drawings and specifications so that they could go else where to get a better price.

Now is this fair?
After all the work has been done, it is easy to get someone to quote off a fully descriptive drawing, at a better price, after all, all the problems have been ironed out. No cost for development, no cost to have worked out how to make and do certain components, which are not standard because the application was not standard, no cost knowing that it is now a proven design.

[adrianh]

Sure, its not fair, but is the risk you take when you hand over the plans. The trick is to give the consultants enough information to shut them up, but not enough to do anything useful with. We've had to hand over plans to customers on occasion. They get a plan that shows input, outputs, breakers and critical components but they sure ain't getting PLC code or part manufacturer details.

[garthu]

@ Daveob and AdrianH... Ahhh...i actually recommend people to get 3 quotes! I agree, to want to quote without competition, now thats not fair... no the question was that getting a quote and handing it to the competition so they may beat it at a small % and win the work. I dont take it personally! Constructively.. not personally.

Some good stuff coming out, @ IanF, there rep proceeds them already, unscrupulous, which is what i consider this as well quite honestly. If i have to win my clients trust by beating a quote THAT I HAVE SEEN... then i think the client should NOT be using me! I like your response cause it's exactly that. remember it's easy to install an electric fence at a 20% discount... but to back it up for 2 years then.. not so easy! Funny this is the companies rep, as big as they are, they dont back up so well

Daveob.. yes good example, a fence we quoted 75K, another company 167K (that i cant fathom) and another 69K. The 69K got the job around a year ago, client had problems, eventually asked me to have a look as was now 2 weeks. When i told them R1600, they told me thats why i didnt get it in the first place, to expensive... GO FIGURE THIS MENTALITY AS THE FENCE IS STILL IN WARRANTY from the other company! Why should i do cheap, fair... but not cheap!

I think form a CLIENT point of view though, when a company asks for your competitions quote to do theres, some responsibility lies with client there to start with. This is probably not the company to go with as far as i am concerned if this is way they win there work.

Anyway my angle is to tackle it from a reputation point of view..., that i can maintain (at the mo and x fingers) and they cant!

[murdock]

here is another angle...my argument with customers is that i need a bill of quantities...detailing...product type and quantity...if they can provide this then i dont have a problem...comparing quotes...then it is like a tender...and you open the quotes on the same day...there is nothing unethical about this...there is just tooo much under hand and walking like an egyptian...one hand up and the other under the back taking.

i can see where all the people who have commented are coming from...we all have the same problem (small comapanies)...the customer want you to do all the consulting work...all they are doing is saving...but are they...because at the end of the day they try get the contractor to design...does the contractor know what he is designing...big problem in SA...then the time to carry out the project...there is no time plan...so the job ends up taking longer because 9 out of 10 the contractors gets some money then starts a new project so the key staff are moved to the new site etc etc...then when the job is completed...is the job actually completed or does it just look like it is...during the project who is checking quality?

so the solution...yes there is a solution and nothing unethical about comparing quotes...provided all the same infomation is provided...design has beeen done...material bill of quantities is provided...your reputation will either get you the job or depending on how straight the person handling the project is...no under hand bussiness will be done...well i suppose i can dream

from my 20 years experience...chances are if its a new customer price will win the project...and if you play your cards right will eventually get the customer...then you stretch the repairs out over a period of time to keep yourself busy as and when you need to be...days when you dont have work...use these customers to keep them busy...at one stage i had at least 6 - -8 months work lined up at any stage...to keep all my teams busy.

[Sparks]

I give a damn good quote and if they not happy tough sh*t. If they get a cheapie to do it and come back to me I will add a surcharge on top of my new quote which will be worked out at a higher rate anyhow. My name is a gaurantee of quality service and it is backed up by my workmanship gaurantee wich is for life, mine.

[wynn]

If everybody who quoted originally gets the opportunity to revise their prices thats fine.
I have a problem with certain contractors who show my prices to the competition and get them to just shave my quote.
If the contractors would just say your prices are a bit high can you do better and leave it at that It wouldn't bother me, but some leave me to price the whole BOQ and then give my priced list to the other guy and he just beats a few meaty items and takes the contract.
Those are the guys I load prices or refuse to give prices to in the future and eventually they become uncompetetive because the other supplier is screwing them and eventually my guys get the work.
Which is great until they get greedy when the other suppliers ask them to shop my prices and the whole cycle begins again.

[BusFact]

I've saved my comments until viewing some of the others, as I really wasn't sure about the morality of it. And my view is now that it depends ....

The customer is most likely asking for trouble with this sort of practice. If the supplier is always going to be the cheapest in a competitive market, then he'll have to cut corners somewhere to survive - most likely in quality.

I can't stand writing out formal quotes. Its such a waste of time. We have pricelists, but some guys want it in a formal quote and we hardly ever hear from those blokes again. There are some products where its a good idea to do a formal quote to clear up variations, options and conditions. Those I don't mind doing so much, but they are not common in my game.

I'm still not decided on the morality angle from the suppliers point of view, but am not convinced its a good business model anyway. To always be the cheapest without a damn good reason to be able to do so, is going to whack your margins. Plus you run the risk of other quoters under quoting just to nail you. I think its a short sighted strategy and there are better ways of getting business.

[FrankyC]

Yes, i know it's an old article, but the answer is relevant. It is not a complicated answer. It's an unethical business practice, simple as that. Let's justify this so that you are aware. A quote prepared is something that takes time from someone. There is always an opportunity cost connected to everything and we all know "time is money", but you're stealing that persons time by this unethical practice. If you are not aware that a prepared quotation is considered intellectual property, then get familiar with it. Taking someones intellectual property and giving it to a competitor is stealing, and can land you in a lot of legal trouble. People need to realign their moral and ethical values at the end of the day. One thing to keep in mind, when someone is more expensive then someone else, there is a reason for it, whether it be experience, accreditation, qualifications, guarantees of workmanship, service levels etc. If after research (key word here) Ii know someone has a good reputation, has proven themselves in the market, and is unchallenged in client service, i'll gladly pay more. The lack of customer service today is ridiculous, so to find it is a rare gem. Pay that extra, it's save you a lot more money in time spent resolving issues, phone calls, follow-ups, fights, arguments, driving up and down etc. You ultimately decide what you want. If you want bad service at a better price then go for it. The point remains that it is unethical to share someones intellectual property with a competitor in order to save a back. The lawsuit alone will bring you to your knees in such a litigation.

[Blurock]

I firmly agree; horse trading is an unethical practice and it is harming businesses all over. It may start with the lack of morality and basic values taught at a young age.
It is unfortunate that 60% of all children born in 2022 have no registered father. No role male model and maybe a mother with dubious moral standards.
Is it then any wonder that crime is rising and ethics is something you only find in a dictionary?