Conspiracy of Silence -- Are you being robbed by your Bank?

[Darkangelyaya]

Securitisation - A Conspiracy of Silence.pdf
Please find attached a report that has taken the internet by storm.
Banks have been lying to us!
Thousands of hard-working people have lost their homes in the process, and through deliberate misrepresentation by the Banks in South Africa.
Get your head out of the sand and start becoming aware of what is happening to 'your' money!
For more information, also visit http://www.newera.org.za

[ians]

I dont believe it, the banks would never lie to us or rip us off.

[Darkangelyaya]

I dont believe it, the banks would never lie to us or rip us off.

Well then, no harm in reading it then?

[Chrisjan B]

I dont believe it, the banks would never lie to us or rip us off.

You are not really that gullible are you?

[IanF]

What I can't understand is you borrow money and still owe some of it. Now the bank has used a funding mechanism to get in more money which involves your borrowings from the bank and you don't owe the money any more.
Have I got the wrong end of the stick?

[adrianh]

I think that ians has his tongue firmly in his cheek

[Blurock]

I dont believe it, the banks would never lie to us or rip us off.

Banks want to be seen as ethical and honest in their dealings. They are the bastions of good business practice. The reality is that managers are under so much pressure to perform, that they and their staff are sometimes pushed to drastic measures just to keep their jobs.

The sub prime scandal, illegal forex dealings, reckless trading, conditional selling (of insurance), interest rate manipulation and many other shady deals are proof of this. Yes, the perpetrators get caught and sentenced, but even banks harbour crooks in their mids.

The executives from time to time hire consulting firms to investigate ways and means of reducing costs and increasing revenues. I do not think that those schemes are always ethical.

I have had first hand experience of a banking group who decided to stop paying the 2% interest on credit balances on cheque accounts. This was unannounced as "clients would not notice". Those that did notice and complained were re-embursed, only to receive a letter a month later that no interest would be paid as standard banking practice.

[Darkangelyaya]

What I can't understand is you borrow money and still owe some of it. Now the bank has used a funding mechanism to get in more money which involves your borrowings from the bank and you don't owe the money any more.
Have I got the wrong end of the stick?

Nope, you have it right!
The fact is, with securitisation, a third party has settled your debt with the Bank; they are also insured against default on payments. Since the Bank has been remunerated for your 'loan', they do not have the legal right to lay claim to your property anymore. Yet they will never disclose this, unless forced, and will continue to bully us as long as we take it, and don't make too many waves.
There are several cases for property repossession in South Africa that have recently been withdrawn (unconditionally) by the Banks, because the bonds were securitised.
Please don't just take my word for it; investigate the links I have posted for yourself.

[IanF]

Nope, you have it right!
The fact is, with securitisation, a third party has settled your debt with the Bank; they are also insured against default on payments. Since the Bank has been remunerated for your 'loan', they do not have the legal right to lay claim to your property anymore. Yet they will never disclose this, unless forced, and will continue to bully us as long as we take it, and don't make too many waves.
There are several cases for property repossession in South Africa that have recently been withdrawn (unconditionally) by the Banks, because the bonds were securitised.
Please don't just take my word for it; investigate the links I have posted for yourself.

OK now someone else has paid your loan (cession to this organisation) you still owe on the loan. This is then administered by the bank and you still owe it. Where can you show value paid. Isn't like financing a car you are the owner but the bank has the title to the car until you settle. How do you prove you have paid?
Then lets extend this to your company doing invoice discounting. After that how can you claim from your customer as you have been paid and then the customer refuses to pay the invoice.

[Darkangelyaya]

OK now someone else has paid your loan (cession to this organisation) you still owe on the loan. This is then administered by the bank and you still owe it. Where can you show value paid. Isn't like financing a car you are the owner but the bank has the title to the car until you settle. How do you prove you have paid?
Then lets extend this to your company doing invoice discounting. After that how can you claim from your customer as you have been paid and then the customer refuses to pay the invoice.

1. It is not ceded, it is bought outright from the Banks;
2. The Bank is never appointed to administer the loan;
3. Your contract is between you and the Bank, not between you and the 'debt owner';
4.The Bank must answer the simple question whether your specific debt has been securitised or not - you don't have to prove you paid - they have to prove not paid (not securitised);
5. It is exactly like financing a car - often credit card debt and vehicle finance also get securitised;
6. For more in-depth legal information, please contact NewEra, as I'm not a legal boffin at all, I'm merely putting the info out there for everyone to make up their own minds - I have a hard enough time already getting simple answers from my banksters.
7. Securitization is a multi-billion dollar industry, also in SA, info is freely available on Banking Regulatory websites in SA.

[IanF]

Darkangel,
When I go to those sites I am totally baffled that is why when I get someone who is straightforward punting this I want to ask the questions. Now for the banks to prove the debt they pull out an agreement and a statement. There is still a balance on the statement what do you put forward as proof of payment?

[Darkangelyaya]

Darkangel,
When I go to those sites I am totally baffled that is why when I get someone who is straightforward punting this I want to ask the questions. Now for the banks to prove the debt they pull out an agreement and a statement. There is still a balance on the statement what do you put forward as proof of payment?

Yes, it is overwhelming and confusing at first.

1. First ask the bank for a copy of your credit agreement.There you will be able to see whom you actually signed with.
2. Ask them outright whether your bond has been securitised. If it has, silence is normally the loud reply. If it hasn't, they should confirm that in writing.
3. Once you have these answers, you can decide which steps to follow.
Needless to say, the banks are not very forthcoming with info.
Also contact ScottyC, on here, or view his youtube videos about the dark secrets of money. (Scott Cundill)

[Blurock]

OK now someone else has paid your loan (cession to this organisation) you still owe on the loan. This is then administered by the bank and you still owe it. Where can you show value paid. Isn't like financing a car you are the owner but the bank has the title to the car until you settle. How do you prove you have paid?
Then lets extend this to your company doing invoice discounting. After that how can you claim from your customer as you have been paid and then the customer refuses to pay the invoice.

If you discount an invoice, the factoring company will collect the debt on your behalf as you have sold all your rights to the proceeds of the invoice to them. If the debtor defaults, the factor can still claim from you in a "with recourse" agreement as you are guaranteeing payment by the debtor. Non-recourse agreements are not normally done in South Africa due to the perceived risk.

You may also have an arrangement where you discount an invoice or debt, but the factor allows you to collect the debt on their behalf. This is called a non-disclosed agreement.

When you pay the shop by credit card, the same principles as with factoring applies. The shop owner "discounts" the invoice with the card company who in turn will collect from the card holder.

[IanF]

@blurock thanks for explaining the invoice discounting this is now understandable.
@darkangel I still can't get my head around how you can prove payment due to securitisation of your loan! Need to put on my deep thinking cap.

[Justloadit]

Even if the securitisation of your bond has taken place, the bank in all probability still stands as the responsible institution/collector in collecting the repayment of the original loan. In the case of non payment of the loan, whether the bank or whether the new owner of the debt will still follow the legal steps to collect their outstanding payment. The manner in which the securitisation is being presented, is giving a false impression that once the bank has securitised the bond, that the original bond is no longer payable. This to me is incorrect, you made a loan, and now you must pay it back.