IRB brought into Bok 'quota' debate

[Cappy]

I would like to hear what the other people's opinion is on the above matter. The article is from Rugby365 where they reported that Afriforum is going to lodge a complain and get the IRB to step in.

Firstly I would like to point out that I'm against this whole quota story, play people on merit. If he is black, white, yellow, brown or purple I really don't care, if he is the best play him and not because he's got a certain skin colour.

Now to get back to my story... Afriforum wants to involve the IRB because SARU will contravene the IRB regulation 20 (Regulation 20 determines that any action in rugby which entails racial discrimination amounts to "misconduct".) should they force Heyneke Meyer to chose black players. So what kind of penalties could IRB enforce on SARU? Give SARU a fine but would that help, No I don't think so. The next possible penalty is to not allow SA Rugby to participate in international tournaments (Rugby Championship, Rugby World Cup, Olympics for the 7's) which means no rugby for the Springboks.

So should the IRB get involve we could see that the Springboks would not be allowed to play anymore which is a win situation for the goverment.
Should SARU ignore the goverment's orders of quota then the goverment will not allow the Springboks to participate in any tournaments...

So if I have missed something what is SARU/SA Rugby left to do because it seems like its a win/win situation for goverment..

[Dave A]

So should the IRB get involve we could see that the Springboks would not be allowed to play anymore which is a win situation for the goverment.

I don't think even the government would see that as a win situation for them.

[Cappy]

I don't think even the government would see that as a win situation for them.

For goverment it's a case of either a Springbok team full of black players or no Springboks at all. I'm sure our goverment and sport minister is well aware that the IRB doesn't tolerate race discrimination and if I remember correctly the minister also threatened that all sponsorships etc. will be withdrawn from the national sides who doesn't comply with the new quota system which basically indicate to me that they couldn't care less if the Springboks play anymore or not as long as it is filled with black players.

[Marq]

If the IRB enforce their rule, whether they are involved in the debate or not, then there will be no need for a quota driven springbok team as they will not be able to play anyone internationally. So end of problem.

If we are not going to have a merit system to choose players then how about two teams? - one merit driven sponsored by commerce (the springboks) and one black quota team sponsored by the Government. (Barugga barugga). They play each other and the winning team represents SA and SARU finances the tour. It should not take long to see which system is the better one.

[Cappy]

If we are not going to have a merit system to choose players then how about two teams? - one merit driven sponsored by commerce (the springboks) and one black quota team sponsored by the Government. (Barugga barugga).

It's exactly what I thought as well. The goverment team will probably end up between 11-20 in world rankings where the SA Barbarian/Rebels team would compete like the Springboks are doing now..
They should actually make a yearly match out of these two teams, should be fun.. EPKings+5 players from other provinces vs Springboks

[Justloadit]

As soon as a quota is instilled, to me means "RACISM", and any excuse to justify the quotas is not acceptable.

What makes players become skilled at their craft, is the internal motivation that they must muster to be the best, with out this motivation, they are an average player.

[wynn]

My 2c says that the powers that be should concentrate on the development of kids beginning age six cause that is the age most springboks begin playing rugby, then when they come through the ranks there will be no argument because the representation will be balanced by only the best players from everywhere in the country.

Here in the Eastern cape we produce a large number of efficient black players who are usually bought out by the bigger franchises, think Bobo, the twins, Mvovo etc. they all played rugby from an early age.

[Butch Hannan]

Why do we not agitate for more whites in our soccer team. If they had more whiteys and a white captain Bafana bafana might achieve something.
Seriously though, there so many more urgent matters that requires the attention of the government than meddling in sport. The money allocated to the sport ministry would be far better spent on education or jacking our police force up!!

[Marq]

The budget has already allocated a third of your tax Rands (before corruption) to Education and Security.
It does not seem to matter what amount is allocated, it will not create a positive result.

Rather promote a reduced tax base and spending on departments that have not shown any benefit to the country.

Instead of going for a new record income and wasting budget, this government should rather see if it can halve the taxes and spend/waste less.

Parties, inauguration costs, grand standing, parliament catering, traveling, body guards and a host of unnecessary expense items cost us far more than sports promotion.

We should rather take the tourism budget, which is not being used to any benefit and use it to properly promote sports teams overseas, which would do a far better job of promoting the country.

I also do not believe overseas people sees any colour issues in a team like the local black racists see it.

[Marq]

Your tax support for the police - another donut, why thank you very much
http://www.iol.co.za/news/south-africa/gauteng/police-blow-r45m-on-food-accommodation-1.1716024#.U7umULGK7jI

[Dave A]

If they had more whiteys and a white captain Bafana bafana might achieve something.

Seriously?

Could you perhaps name some white players who are missing in the national squad to back that thought up?

[Blurock]

My 2c says that the powers that be should concentrate on the development of kids beginning age six cause that is the age most springboks begin playing rugby, then when they come through the ranks there will be no argument because the representation will be balanced by only the best players from everywhere in the country.

Here in the Eastern cape we produce a large number of efficient black players who are usually bought out by the bigger franchises, think Bobo, the twins, Mvovo etc. they all played rugby from an early age.

That is exactly the reason why Bafana are so useless. It takes 10 years of apprenticeship to learn a skill and to be really good at what you do, whether it is playing the piano, managing a business or playing sport.

Fact is, there are no structures for soccer at black schools. After the administrators have taken their share of sponsorships, the coffers are empty and there is nothing left for developing young players. You cannot start learning the skills of the game at 18 or 19 and then expect to perform at international level.

The rugby players on the other hand, are being taught the finer points of the game from primary school. There are structures and organised competitions right through the schools system. That is why the Springboks have twice won the Rugby World Cup. The Springbok team may have 15 black players for all I care, as long as they have been chosen on merit.

There is no place for racism in sport and that is exactly what the proposed quota system is!

[Butch Hannan]

Good morning to you Dave,
My comment was more "tongue in cheek" I do not particularly care about soccer but I am a rugby supporter and in fact provincially support "The Sharks" although I live in Mpumalanga. I have a vague recollection of a person called Neil Tovey, Eric Tinkler etc. They won the African Cup that year

[wynn]

If they do introduce quotas all the really good whitey rugby players will become mercenaries and play for other countries and if they have not played for SA they can become citizens of their chosen countries and play for them.
Of course sponsorship will disappear and we will all watch satellite broadcasts of the 'Heineken Cup' and the 'Super 10' as played between Australia and New Zealand.

Perhaps some enterprising individual will start the 'Botswana Rugby leauge' populated entirely by expat 'Saffers'

[Dave A]

I think Blurock's post above strikes to the truth here - it's the quality of programs at the primary and high school level that really matter, whether in-school itself or via excellence programs working in conjunction with the schools. It really makes a huge difference.

And if the politicians don't like what they're seeing at the national level, it's at the schools where they need to start putting in the effort to turn things around.