High Profile Cases - what really happens in the workplace

[JanChris]

Has anyone had an experience or have an opinion regarding some institutions / unions only seeking high profile media cases?

I notice that on this forum some comments made fail to give straight hard hitting answers. Or am I "reading" it wrong?

Do we live in a society where we like to say what the other party wants to here?

I am interested in what really happens in the workplace and not what should happen.

[adrianh]

Nobody on this forum says anything purely because it is politically correct. We all speak frankly and openly and often have rip roaring disagreements.

You are welcome to speak your mind!

[JanChris]

I would like someone who has knowledge of this to give their comment. I think it is an interesting topic as I am sure that we all know what really happens in the workplace. I have occupied a senior management position for over 20 years and it appears to me that I am but a few who try to keep it honest and fair, much to my own detriment within the company.

[HR Solutions]

I feel that people say exactly what they want to say in the work environment. With the new Y generation coming up thro the ranks, you need to employ different ways of management - one of them being truthfull, open and transparent. The old way of leading people with the whip is no longer. Your staff will leave. When interviewing people they say exactly what they want to say - they basically don't give a damn about the next person and have the "if they don't like it then tough" attitude.

I disagree about comments on the forum not being straight and direct. I think most of us here say what we think and face the consequences later

[JanChris]

Why do the "honest" people speak their mind only on the forum but are reprimanded in the workplace? Some have lost their jobs due to their "honesty"?

[HR Solutions]

Jan - in most modern day transparent companies, honesty is encouraged - honesty bring fresh dynamic ideas especially from younger people - you cannot expect people to come to work and work just for the sake of work. They need to enjoy it, need to be heard, need to be listened and their ideas implemented if they are great ideas. I am busy implementing a structure and analysis - Top 10 ways to keep staff (Retention) ..... I think you might be referring to older strongly established Afrikaans companies ??

[JanChris]

I was the "afrikaans" person who after many years at a company "lost" my work due to honesty. I am the person who sent "previously disadvantaged" employees to be qualified. I was "diplomatically" outspoken in what I believe to be "human" but at the end it cost my family and I dearly. Please explain to me what my honesty benefitted me. As I mentoined before, I have proof of the wrong doings but at the end it only cost me. It only once again shows the power of money.

[HR Solutions]

Please explain to me what my honesty benefitted me

I think it would be a lot easier if you explained why you lost your company because of "honesty" because you only refer to sending people to get qualified. Let me ask you : Why do you do that ? And second question is: How long did they work for you after they got qualified ? And third question is: Did you sign a contract with them when you "paid" for the qualification ?

PS: Sending people to get trained is not being "honest" - it is improving skills for that person, for the country and for your own company. How you manage that before and after is up to you.

[JanChris]

I sent a person for training not only to benefit the company but also the individual. It would also be more cost effective to have that person qualified in that task than sending the work out or to hire artisans and perform the work in house. The reason for mentioning this was that not all "afrikaans" people or "afrikaans" company owners fall into the category that you made mention of.

I lost my work due to the fact that I was aware of defect steel structure work being covered up with window putty that was to be installed at a power station and that a charge sheet was fabricated to have a disciplinary enquiry. I was informed of this by my immediate superior.

How would you react if you were in the same position?

NB: I am a Production/Factory Manager with tertiary qualifications.

[adrianh]

@JanChris - I became vastly unpopular in the corporate world for speaking my mind. I am ADHD and don't always really know what is appropriate and what not. People DO NOT like people who talk straight. The workplace is like a crèche of little kids each with their own insecurities. The problem is that each persons up the ladder is insecure too. Working in the corporate world is a dance of being politically correct, step on another's toes and face the consequences. I was forced to resign from an IT company because of politics. I vowed that I would never work in IT nor the corporate environment again.

My view is that being perfectly honest is a very bad idea. People DO NOT like it. I've been kicked off numerous Facebook photography groups for being too straight and honest in my views. The lesson that I've taken from the corporate environment, Facebook and people in general is to keep my mouth shut and to stay out of it (except on this forum)...even when I'm right and they are wrong. I have a very bad habit of standing up for the rights of others and I have also learned that when the shit hits the fan all those people that I stood up for run a mile. I've even been told that "we never asked you to stand up for us"

My view is this "Be very careful to choose the people you care for and the people you would expend energy on" We live in a consumerist society where people are as expendable as Bic lighters. The biggest lesson for me was that I need to be the master of my universe, I need to do what I want and not have to answer to some twit who is in a position higher than me but has no brain.

To put the way I feel about the corporate world, being politically correct, dancing around people's feeling etc. is this: F*ck Em!

[Houses4Rent]

Hi

I agree with Adrian

I too withdrew from the corporate world as I was tired of having to play games and not being heard. Being German and a (former) rather analytical engineer I guess the straight talk is programmed in my DNA. I then started my own company in a totally different industry and now I speak my mind even to my paying clients. Most learnt to accept it as they realsied that I am (mostly) ultimately right and that I am doing it for their own good. The ones who continue to not like my ways and fail to see the bigger picture and my motivation behind it can take a hike.

JanChris: how did the story end? Woudl it not have been easier/less risk to tip off the relevant authorities/the customer anonymoulsy?

[HR Solutions]

The reason for mentioning this was that not all "afrikaans" people or "afrikaans" company owners fall into the category that you made mention of.

Yes I do agree. I merely said that from my experience the problems normally originate from older companies .... but not all.


Houses 4 rent is agreeing and disagreeing. So it would seem that in the corporate world it is slightly different. I must be honest I do not have too much experience in this as we normally deal with smaller companies ie not the Nedbanks, Foschini's etc (ie corporate)
But certainly in smaller companies I do not get the feel that you cannot speak your mind.

[adrianh]

You really can't. I've worked for big and small IT companies. None of them want to hear you speak your mind. You have to count your words very carefully and make sure that what you have to say is not too far from their ideas and views. It is terrible in small companies. Imagine that the boss wrote 80% of the system in Cobol in the '80s and he is mentally incapable of making the leap to Object Oriented Programming and Relational Databases. He buys the latest version of Delphi and SQL Server and then wraps all his Cobol code in a new jacket. He alters every aspect of the Windows interface to work as it did in Cobol and then goes on to treat his SQL Server database as one would use a Dbase III database. Then the guy gets cheesed off when you tell him that you simply don't work like that. To cut a long story short, every one of his employees, except me of course, simply say that if that is what the doo$ wants then so be it. It didn't take long for me to get kicked out for disagreeing with the boss....

[HR Solutions]

Aaaaah ok now youre talking about IT - Yes IT guys are a different breed of people all together - they tend to be the introvert type wherever they are.

[Greig Whitton]

In my experience, people who claim to speak their mind generally don't use it before they open their mouth. "Honesty" and "tact" are not mutually exclusive.