Application for connection of embedded generation

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  • Isetech
    Platinum Member

    • Mar 2022
    • 2274

    #1

    Application for connection of embedded generation

    A topic I need to understand.

    I have downloaded the info from our local metro.

    The top line "A maximum generation of 4.6 KVA single phase and 13.8 KVA 3 phase" that already caught my attention.

    99 % of inverters we have installed are larger than 4.6 KVA, I have only installed 1 less 4.6 KVA and it is just a backup unit.
    Comments are my opinion, unless regulations are attached to support the comment. This is social media, not a court room.
  • GCE
    Platinum Member

    • Jun 2017
    • 1472

    #2
    Originally posted by Isetech
    A topic I need to understand.

    I have downloaded the info from our local metro.

    The top line "A maximum generation of 4.6 KVA single phase and 13.8 KVA 3 phase" that already caught my attention.

    99 % of inverters we have installed are larger than 4.6 KVA, I have only installed 1 less 4.6 KVA and it is just a backup unit.
    It is to do with the NERS document NRS097-2-1 - Have pasted extract below
    Look at note 2 - If you fit a 5Kw unit and the base load of the house is 400w you will only be able to export 4.6kw - You can limit an inverter feedback to grid.
    It is to keep voltage on the grid stable - Can you imagine if only every third house in your street had PV installed and all were pumping 4,6Kw back into the grid what the voltage would look like.
    The 4.6Kw is 25% of main CB size which is also a Nersa requirement.
    At the end of the day the Utility has final say - If an area of one suburb starts going over 75% of minisub load the Utility could stop any further PV installs in that area to maintain a stable voltage


    4.1.1.7 The utility will approve the size of the embedded generator and will decide on the connection point and conditions. In some cases it may be required to create a separate supply point.
    4.1.1.8 Embedded generators larger than 13,8 kVA shall be of the balanced three-phase type unless only a single-phase network supply is available, in which case NRS 097-2-3 recommendations can be applied based on the NMD.
    NOTE 1 This value refers to the maximum export potential of the generation device/system.
    NOTE 2 In the case of long feeder spurs the maximum desired capacity of the EG might require approval by the utility and might result in the requirement for a three-phase connection for smaller units.
    4.1.1.9 A customer with a multiphase connection shall split the embedded generator in a balanced manner over all phases if the EG is larger than 4,6 kVA.

    Comment

    • Isetech
      Platinum Member

      • Mar 2022
      • 2274

      #3
      I believe the problem at the moment is people dont understand the definitions, what they have to register and why.

      I also believe that due to the lack of public awareness of local metro bylaws, the industry skills shortage causing a major problem, people are desperate to keep the lights, machines running to make a living. Do you blame them.

      If you had to do a survey on how people feel about registering a system and if people are concerned about the consequences of their action, 80 % + would tell you they dont care. People have lost faith in Eskom and believe the problem will be sorted out any time soon.

      I agree with many, that it is unfair that they are put in this situation by the same people who are going to be penalised for fixing a problem they didn't create, but rather helped to rectify, by adding more power.

      It is going to be interesting to see what is going to happen to people who have already installed units bigger than 5 or 8.8 kva, depending on your metro.







      To be grid-tied, the generator needs to belong to an existing Eskom customer.
      • Whether the generator is intending to export onto the grid, or not, Eskom will still need to ensure that
      • the connection is legal (registration, grid code compliance and adherence to technical standards);
      • that the tariff is a time-of-use (TOU) tariff option and appropriate meters are installed.
      • If non-adherence to the terms and conditions is evident, corrective action is taken (in the form of
      • remedial action i.e. Eskom will require the SSEG to be disconnected and a tamper fee maybe issued
      • and lost revenue recovered).


      Consumers who wish to have their generation facility to produce electricity primarily for their own use may apply to be an embedded generation facility. A consumer with embedded generators is allowed to connect his load facilities to the power grid for additional and/or backup electricity supply.


      "embedded generation

      Distributed generation and storage enables the collection of energy from many sources and may lower environmental impacts and improve the security of supply. One of the major issues with the integration of the DER such as solar power, wind power, etc. is the uncertain nature of such electricity resources."
      Comments are my opinion, unless regulations are attached to support the comment. This is social media, not a court room.

      Comment

      • Isetech
        Platinum Member

        • Mar 2022
        • 2274

        #4
        This is the part that is going to get interesting --- does it mean "maybe" and who will suffer the people who can afford the fines or everyone?



        • If non-adherence to the terms and conditions is evident, corrective action is taken (in the form of
        • remedial action i.e. Eskom will require the SSEG to be disconnected and a tamper fee maybe issued
        • and lost revenue recovered).
        Comments are my opinion, unless regulations are attached to support the comment. This is social media, not a court room.

        Comment

        • Isetech
          Platinum Member

          • Mar 2022
          • 2274

          #5
          Comments are my opinion, unless regulations are attached to support the comment. This is social media, not a court room.

          Comment

          • Isetech
            Platinum Member

            • Mar 2022
            • 2274

            #6
            The NRS-097-2-1-201 if anyone is looking for a copy.

            FOR the record --- This document is not a South African National Standard


            Comments are my opinion, unless regulations are attached to support the comment. This is social media, not a court room.

            Comment

            • Isetech
              Platinum Member

              • Mar 2022
              • 2274

              #7
              The big question is do I have to register my system.

              If I have any of the following, do I have to register it ?

              A big online UPS connected to servers, computers etc ?

              A solar panel supplying power in combination with the grid to a pump for my jojo tank ?

              A generator with an ATS connected to my DB ?

              A backup off grid inverter/UPS which has no solar panels connected, but is connected into the DB ?

              A backup off grid inverter/UPS which has solar panels and connected to the grid, but is not bi directional, so it cant feedback into the grid?

              A grid tied inverter with panels ?

              A hybrid inverter which doesnt have solar connected ?

              A hybrid inverter which has solar but not feeding back into the grid ?

              Have I left any out ?
              Comments are my opinion, unless regulations are attached to support the comment. This is social media, not a court room.

              Comment

              • Isetech
                Platinum Member

                • Mar 2022
                • 2274

                #8
                Once you understand the terms and definitions, it will make it easier to understand what is required.


                embedded generator, EG: one or more energy generation sources that includes the energyconversion device (devices), the static power converter (converters), if applicable, and the controland protection gear within a customer’s network that operate in synchronism with the utility’s supplyNOTE 1 Examples of energy conversion devices are photovoltaic modules, fuel cells, induction generators orsynchronous generators.NOTE 2 Embedded generation is also referred to as “distributed” or “dispersed generation” in otherdocuments.NOTE 3 The embedded generator may include storage devices, such as lead-acid batteries in which casethe size of the generator (typically inverter) is defined as the maximum change in apparent power flow at thepoint of utility connection for a generator trip (or rapid reduction in output) when generating at full active poweroutput. This means that a part of the generator’s size is effectively hidden from the network (behind the meter)by the same size load that will be removed from the grid along with a trip of the generator.
                Comments are my opinion, unless regulations are attached to support the comment. This is social media, not a court room.

                Comment

                • Derlyn
                  Platinum Member

                  • Mar 2019
                  • 1747

                  #9
                  How would my system be described ?

                  Inverter with batteries that are charged by pv panels.

                  Inverter output is connected to the DB via a change over switch as if it was a generator. It is never connected to the grid. The change over switch sees to that.

                  Comment

                  • Isetech
                    Platinum Member

                    • Mar 2022
                    • 2274

                    #10
                    Originally posted by Derlyn
                    How would my system be described ?

                    Inverter with batteries that are charged by pv panels.

                    Inverter output is connected to the DB via a change over switch as if it was a generator. It is never connected to the grid. The change over switch sees to that.

                    A backup off grid inverter/UPS which has solar panels and connected to the grid, but is not bi directional, so it cant feedback into the grid?

                    Comments are my opinion, unless regulations are attached to support the comment. This is social media, not a court room.

                    Comment

                    • Isetech
                      Platinum Member

                      • Mar 2022
                      • 2274

                      #11
                      People seem to have tons cash to throw at this industry at the moment, you might say maybe not, all you have to do is look at the supply and demand. If a container lands today, the 500 units in the container are already sold and paid for, the container arriving in 2 days time, the contents are already sold and paid for.

                      Smart people have made a lot of money, dont let anyone bullshyte you that the margins are small, it doesnt matter when you turning over R10 M a week and already have money in the bank for shipments due to arrive for the next month or two.

                      R6000 profit on A R30 k battery is not a "small margin" as someone pointed out to me the other day. 2.5 % margin would be regarded as a small margin

                      It got me thinking if everyone is rushing and blows R150 + on a solar system, the energy crisis will be over sooner then later, unless you have a couple bar to buy up stock and make tons of cash, while people a silly spending, wouldnt it be smarter to just be patient. We still havent had load shedding, and it doesnt seem like we will be affected any time soon.
                      Comments are my opinion, unless regulations are attached to support the comment. This is social media, not a court room.

                      Comment

                      • Derlyn
                        Platinum Member

                        • Mar 2019
                        • 1747

                        #12
                        Originally posted by Isetech

                        A backup off grid inverter/UPS which has solar panels and connected to the grid, but is not bi directional, so it cant feedback into the grid?

                        I tend to disagree. It is never connected to the grid.

                        Comment

                        • Isetech
                          Platinum Member

                          • Mar 2022
                          • 2274

                          #13
                          Originally posted by Derlyn
                          I tend to disagree. It is never connected to the grid.

                          How does that sound?

                          *EDIT* A backup off grid inverter/UPS which has solar panels and connected to the DB, but is not bi directional, so it cant feedback into the grid?
                          Comments are my opinion, unless regulations are attached to support the comment. This is social media, not a court room.

                          Comment

                          • Derlyn
                            Platinum Member

                            • Mar 2019
                            • 1747

                            #14
                            Cool. Because it's connected to the DB, doesn't mean it's connected to the grid. 👍👍

                            Comment

                            • Isetech
                              Platinum Member

                              • Mar 2022
                              • 2274

                              #15
                              What is the DB connected to?

                              Originally posted by Derlyn
                              Cool. Because it's connected to the DB, doesn't mean it's connected to the grid. 
                              Comments are my opinion, unless regulations are attached to support the comment. This is social media, not a court room.

                              Comment

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