[Question] A better solution for alarm backup

[ians]

I am looking for a better solution for backing up an alarm system.

What is the problem ...load shedding or power outages.

A standard alarm panel has a 7 amp/hr battery backup... if you have a very basic 4-8 zones system with basic equipment ...it shouldn't be a problem.

So why are people replacing 7 amp/hr batteries ever 3-6 months.

The charging device used in an alarm is a trickle charger ..which basically tops up a fully charged battery ...you have load shedding/power failure ...so long as the battery voltage doesnt drop below 10,5 VDC ...the battery will take a few days and be fully charged ...however in some areas power outages and load shedding happens more frequently ...which results in the battery being drained to a point of no return ...you call the alarm company ,...they charge you R750 + to replace the battery ...take your 3 month old battery top it up with water (no they are not sealed) and boost it with another 12 volt battery ... leave it over night to fully charge and presto ...you have a pile of spares.

Then the customer is offered a better solution ...an 18 amp/hr battery and charger ...it will work so long as you dont have lots of power outages ... because the power pack supplied for the 18 amp/hr has a 5 amp charger... it will charge a lot faster... there is a catch these batteries only last around 2-3 years if you are lucky...so ever 2 years it cost R1000 to replace.

i am looking for a better backup solution.

A solution which has a small inverter (pure sine wave) type setup with a lithium battery ...which can connect to a solar panel.

One which has enough power to run just an alarm system.

One to backup a router ...an alarm and CCTV system.

I know it would be better to backup using 12 volts looses and all ... not worth the hassle...it must be a plug and play.

Minimum of 5 days backup.

[GCE]

Hi

Have you seen/looked at the lithium replacement type battery for the alarm systems - Same physical size as the 7amp/hr
Had a look at them and the life span looked better , an easy quick swop as it works on the same charger - Price was prohibitive but when worked out against replacing all the time was worth while.
Was ordering to test but had to order a box of 6 , i think , then all hell broke loose , got put on the back burner and along came Covid

[ians]

Hi

Have you seen/looked at the lithium replacement type battery for the alarm systems - Same physical size as the 7amp/hr
Had a look at them and the life span looked better , an easy quick swop as it works on the same charger - Price was prohibitive but when worked out against replacing all the time was worth while.
Was ordering to test but had to order a box of 6 , i think , then all hell broke loose , got put on the back burner and along came Covid

That is what i am looking for a lithium replacement battery... these 7 amp/hr are a money spinner for alarm and gate companies... finding a better solution to ease the replacement burden for the customer could be a winner.

People say the gel is the new best thing since sliced bread ...it just costs more ...but i have personally not seen any benefit ...still see batteries being replaced as early as 3-4 months ...with the same excuse ...load shedding.

[Justloadit]

That is what i am looking for a lithium replacement battery... these 7 amp/hr are a money spinner for alarm and gate companies... finding a better solution to ease the replacement burden for the customer could be a winner.

People say the gel is the new best thing since sliced bread ...it just costs more ...but i have personally not seen any benefit ...still see batteries being replaced as early as 3-4 months ...with the same excuse ...load shedding.

You can get them from S.J. Andrews - in Johannesburg.

[GCE]

Hi

Have attached a spec sheet on the one battery I was looking at - Was priced around R 1 300.00 ex vat and had to buy a box of 8

[ians]

The big question??? will you save money replacing a 7 amp/hr lead acid or gel battery (@R200) with a lithium replacement battery (@R1300) and why ?

A R200 lead acid or gel battery lasts on average ...around 2-3 years....add in 2 hours a day load shedding a day and a 5 day trickle charger and you cut the lifespan to around 3-6 months if you are lucky.

So you replace the battery every 6 months ...in 2 years you spend around R 3000 (@R750 a pop to replace including technician fee)

A R1300 lithium battery will last ...10-20 years ?

Keep the alarm running longer ...because it can drop to 1 % DOD ... might damage the electronics if not cut out at 10.5 volts ?

Save in technician replacement costs?

If I were an alarm manufacturing business ...i would be looking into a longer running time (than 5 hours ...more like 12 -24 hrs) using lithium batteries to power not only the alrm but all the other stuff ...beams... expander boards etc.

My thoughts are rather use a pure sine wave inverter with a 20 amp/hr battery and maybe even a solar panel ...i know some will say due to looses it is better to stick with 12 VDC direct ...but ...using a pure sine wave inverter with a slightly bigger battery would mena you can also backup your NVR ...router and the like .

[ians]

I was busy replacing batteries in a couple of UPs units this morning and realised that that is exactly what i need.

A pure sine wave UPS with a 30 - 40 amp/hr lithium battery and a built in 3-4 amp charger ... instead of lead acid batteries

[ians]

from the research i have done ...a lithium battery solves all the issue experienced with the little 7 amp/hr lead acid/gel batteries ... by the way from my experience the gel battery is just a money spinner ..they dont last much longer in a load shedding situation.

Starting with the recharge time required for a lead acid ...it is significantly reduced to a few hours compared to lead acid ... so then all we need to to discuss the charger with the alarm manufacturer... a slightly faster charger would turn the system into a load shedding friendly unit.

You extend the life of the battery which would normally be between 2-3 years for the 7 amp/hr (some say 3-5 years ..not from my experience.) under normal conditions ...add 2- 4 hours a day load shedding and a trickle charger ...you lucky to get 3-6 months... you literally pissing maney against the wall

A lithium battery because of the DOD will not get damaged if it drops to 10 % capacity compared to lead acid... so you have a win win situation ...but more important in this crime riddled country ...your system will stay armed and functioning.

Just a note ...man this cctv linked to the alarm works like a bomb ... false alarms are no longer a pain in the butt ... it also identifies what causes the false alarm making it easier to find a solution ...be it the cat jumping onto the window sill or a monkey running on a wall or even swaying vegetation.

[Justloadit]

Yes, I look at a Lead acid battery as a consumable, not an asset. This places a very different aspect to the cost of keeping your system alive.

[debtcollectorZA]

I bought a 22ah Bluenova battery for my UPS. I did some diy to have the battery sit outside the UPS as it is much bigger than the standard 7ah lead acid. It lasts longer than the 7ah as you'd expect being 3 times the capacity but not much longer. I suspect because the lithium has a higher float voltage thus the UPS stops charging before the battery is full.

I want to do the same for my alarm as loadshedding kills those lead acid batteries in months, not years.

To what voltage would a Paradox alarm charge the battery? Is there a way to up this voltage to 14.4 to fully charge the lithium battery?

[ians]

Unfortunately I am not familiar with the paradox system ... the reason I use and support IDS ... I can contact the technical department and dicuss these kind of queries.

When I spoke to the people at blue nova a while back ... they informed me that I wouldnt need to change anything on my alarm.

[Justloadit]

I bought a 22ah Bluenova battery for my UPS. I did some diy to have the battery sit outside the UPS as it is much bigger than the standard 7ah lead acid. It lasts longer than the 7ah as you'd expect being 3 times the capacity but not much longer. I suspect because the lithium has a higher float voltage thus the UPS stops charging before the battery is full.

I want to do the same for my alarm as loadshedding kills those lead acid batteries in months, not years.

To what voltage would a Paradox alarm charge the battery? Is there a way to up this voltage to 14.4 to fully charge the lithium battery?

Whoa - you can not replace a Lead Acid with a Lithium with out changing the charger.
Battery chargers are not interchangeable when it comes to Lithium batteries.

You must get a separate battery charger for the lithium battery, then insert a Skotky diode in series with the battery to your alarm system. This is to stop the system charger from feeding back to the battery.

[ians]

Whoa - you can not replace a Lead Acid with a Lithium with out changing the charger.
Battery chargers are not interchangeable when it comes to Lithium batteries.

You must get a separate battery charger for the lithium battery, then insert a Skotky diode in series with the battery to your alarm system. This is to stop the system charger from feeding back to the battery.

Not according to Blue nova ... I was told the 7 amp/hr was design designed and built as a replacement to the lead acid battery ... I dont have the knowledge or experience to comment ... just what I was told ... that sure that it applies to the 22 amp/hr ... I would contact blue nova and verify.

[Justloadit]

Not according to Blue nova ... I was told the 7 amp/hr was design designed and built as a replacement to the lead acid battery ... I dont have the knowledge or experience to comment ... just what I was told ... that sure that it applies to the 22 amp/hr ... I would contact blue nova and verify.

Will be interested in what they say.
Lithium by nature of its chemistry does not match the same voltages of lead acid.
The so called label of 12V is more of an indication of the voltage that it reaches at some point when working.
Just like lead acid, a fully charged battery starts out at 13.8V, then drops to 13.2V then as you use it , the voltage slowly drops down, and at about 11V it is approximately at 50% of capacity. When it reaches 10.5V it is almost depleted of its energy.

Next time take your Volt meter with and see what the terminal voltage is.
Just remember that your alarm system will look at 10.5V as a flat battery.