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lets look at this issue i have with the builders electrician on site at the moment he is still doing the work...is is completely unregistered not with the ecb,,,workmans comp...uif etc etc...he is almost finished connecting the building... i think the building inspector is going to request a COC or maybe he takes a back hand i dont know...the point is... whoever is going to sign over this installaton doesnt know that there are 11 junction boxes under the plaster...unless you have my pictures...because he has never been to site during the progress of the job...if it passes the instrument test it is fine...at least if something goes wrong and the 2 or 3 year old living in the house is killed on site he should be able to get away with it...the problem is the person who is gona be accountable is whoever signs over the COC not the person who did the work this is why i have walked away from the job...then on brighter note maybe nothing ever goes wrong then everyone can say what was all the fuss about...in fact i have made a decision in future not to fuss a about things anymore either...i get myself worked up for nothing... as i mentioned before i personally believe the COC is a money making racket and as long as the public are prepared to waste their money on them who am i to say any different...i cant help people who cant help themselves.
Dave
maybe you should do some unexpected visits to some of the sites your company has tested...i would hate to be the one to put pics on your website.
That is exactly what is going through my mind. My guys are pretty good, and if there was a mistake I trust it would be an honest one, but you've raised the sort of stuff that I'd like to make sure is front of their mind... Just in case.
Originally posted by murdock
lets look at this issue i have with the builders electrician on site at the moment he is still doing the work...is is completely unregistered not with the ecb,,,workmans comp...uif etc etc...he is almost finished connecting the building... i think the building inspector is going to request a COC or maybe he takes a back hand i dont know...the point is... whoever is going to sign over this installaton doesnt know that there are 11 junction boxes under the plaster...
I think this is exactly the crux, particularly with new installations.
What is needed is a COC with all the details of a new installation completed, which is subtlely different from a COC that is issued arising from a test situation.
The electricity supplier needs this COC before they will supply power. Now I'd hope that they are paying attention to that subtle difference between a "test only" certificate and a "new installation" certificate.
But even if they do, there is a fair chance that your mate has an arrangement with a wireman to sign off with the "correct" details anyway.
well the COC has been issued...i confronted the electrical contractor advised him he has 2 options 1 withdraw the COC rectify the problems or 2... i contact 3 independent companies to to whom i will give copies of the photos...meet them on site to indicate the problem i have encountered during the course of the installation...once i have all their reports i will then contact ian mee the highway mail and the daily news and not forgetting brian bilton because i would like him to see what all the fuss is about and last but not least the person responsible for isssuing the COC...i will then expose the master electrician for the fraud he is...but before i could finish was told they would withdraw the COC...i then got a call to advise me that the master electrian who was suppose to collect his fraudulant COC and apologise to the customer is on leave till the middle of Jan 2008...well we all know what that means...unfortunately for these people i have taken this personally and see it as a kick in the teeth and will not let this go even if it takes me until 2010 to sort it out...once i get all my facts straight will be exposing the electrical contractor and master electrician by company and names if this forum will allow it.
this picture looks harmless...where in fact this is one of the most dangerous pictures i have...this is a 3 phase 400 volt cable strap to a refrigeration pipe below a counter in a shop...the cable is joined together with connector blocks and taped up with insulation tape... so what is so bad about that you ask...well the firstly it is on the ground the joint are not ip65 which means that when the people working here get the mop and start cleaning...the joints are submersed in water... how someone hasnt been electricuted here yet i am still puzzled...the only explaination i have is that when they clean... the motors are not running or they are standing in gum boots cleaning.
the customer has no claim against the company responsible for the work carried out in this image as it is busy going into liquidation...just hope you are not outstanding money from this company it is one of the big refrigeration companies in durban.
My husband and I were discussing the issue of the tendency to sue for almost anything in the U.S.A. Our grandchild was invited to a birthday party, included in the invitation was a disclaimer from any possibility of sueing which had to be signed and handed in on arrival at the party venue.
We were further shocked when we were advised to tell "play date" parents of any potential dangers, such as a trampoline, and to protect ourselves from the possibility of being sued.
Our grandchild is not permitted to take cupcakes to school (They must be arranged through the canteen!)
Although I truly am horrified for the necessity of such caution, I argue that at least this must raise the standard of workmen etc. (provided one checks that the company is insured!), as no company would take a chance of being sued!
The average person has absolutely no way of "checking" electrical work carried out!
Clearly there is basically no concern regarding professional accountability by some contractors, a further concern is that this results in "unfair" pricing between competing quotes, as reputable companies have higher operating costs in doing the work right in the first place, and has the added cost of adequate insurance cover.
The "fly by the seat of their pants" company gets away with what I personally consider potential "criminal" negligence -especially in the case of the installation at an aged residence.
If you do attempt to sue in South Africa it seems as if one has to prove that an "intent to do harm" has to be proven before negligence results in any liability, this is not serving our rights.
i was a witness in a robbery were one of the security company personal almost shot me by mistake...the bullet missed me by about 30 cm and logged in the fridge next to me...i opened a case of negligant use of a firearm in a public place...i was treated like a criminal and threatened with all sorts of things...i spent hours in court waiting for the case to actually happen after days wasted in court i walked away...then i was sent a warrent for my arrest because i decided to stop wasting my time going to court...i was then forced to go to court wasted 6 hours in pinetown court to be told the case had been thrown out...bottom line i dont see or her no evil anymore.
the only prosecuting system that works in this country is when you dont pay a parking ticket and dont appear in court they send an armed task team out to collect you and lock you up without bail until you pay which was a R50 then became a R350 one because i didnt appear i court on the due date..trust me on this one i have had first hand experience.
something i just thought of which might help if you think the coc or work carried out is not up to standard...the ECA offers R1500.00 defective workmanship cover...make sure the contractor is an eca member...if the work is not up to standard put in a claim against the ECA for defective workmanship and see what happens...i dont know of anyone who has claimed but if anyone has...please let us know what the outcome was.
dave i have been requested to do a coc inspection on a property in westville...regent place which has just been sold...apparently there is some history...i have been given a pile of documentation with a coc issued on the 15 march 2004 indicating the installation is safe by a company with a postal address in balito and a faults list which was done shortly after the owner moved in because of a despute that the installation was not safe...since then another electrical company has done minor electrical repairs and maintence...i have been given the task of checking the installation to verify if the faults list is valid and and if so put a value to the repairs required...and to carry out a full inspection of the installation because the customer (seller)doesnt want to be caught up in a battle with the purchaser...this sounds like it is going to be an interesting test.
Thanks for letting me know, Murdock. All I know for sure is we're a lot better at this than when we first started out.
The job rings a bell, which means there must have been some drama along the line if I got to hear about it. I can't remember what it was all about, though. I'll pass the message on to Alan who is director in charge of technical for electrical. It'll probably mean more to him.
Already your insurance will not pay out if the work done was not covered by a certificate and it causes a fire, there is no doubt about that, read the fine print in your policy.
Lee
To make a mistake is human, to learn from that mistake is knowledge and knowledge is strength.
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