spazio light fittings

[murdock]

i am sure some people like myself have looked at the catalog and thought wow what cool expensive looking good quality light fittings...until you actually order them and get them delivered.

we order over R48 000 worth of fittings...they arrive on site and all the packaging was damaged...what i should have done...is not even sign for them...i should have returned the entire order...but due to long waiting period and contract completion dates...i had to open the fittings and install them...unfortunatetly some of the light fittings where so badly damaged that they had to be returned...and 2 of the identical model number but 2 completly diffrent fittings also had to be returned...spazio blamed the courier company.

so the next batch arrives with the replacements and some fittings outstanding from the order...this time i got smart...and got a witness to watch as i removed the fittings from the packaging...i removed 2 fittings and of the 2 i removed 1 was damaged and the other missing parts....so the next step...contact spazio who sent out a rep...i advised the customer that i could not accept the fitting until him and the spazio rep had cleared the fittings in working order...3 days later...out of 10 fittings the rep managed to replace parts and fit parts missing and managed to get 4 of the 10 fittings...but that wasnt even all the problems...when the rep tried to repair one of the fitting which where already installed he had to break the end cap off to try remove it...then blamed me the contractor for super glueing the end caps onto the fittings...eeeish and thats when i dont play nicely...when you start accusing me for something i didnt do...so i walk out the room and go stand outside while i counted to 100 and took a deep breath before someone got hurt...here the joke as i walk back in the room i notice the rep removing a brand new fitting out of a sealed box...you wont believe what i saw...the end cap was not fitting flush with the end of the fitting...and yes there it was a blob of super glue or what ever they tried to use to fix the problem...the rep then told me that it must have been a mould issue...because the nipple which is suppose to clinp into the hole on the metal frame was not lining up...so to overcome the problem they must have glued all the end caps on...but a percentage of them had come loose between the factory in china (i found out that spazio fitting are like most products manufactued in china) and site...here the joke...spazio will not accept the fitting back because they saying the fittings are not in the original packaging and will therefore not pass a credit...heres the joke the spazio rep removed all the fittings from the packaging and walked off site...leaving all the fittings lying on the tables out the boxes...i should have just rolled them up into a bundle and dumped them on the pavement...and told them to collect...but instead i took the time to repacked all the fitting and cleaned up the reps mess.

the way i see it all the fittings are rejects....and should all be replaced at spaizios cost...even the ones already installed...considering we have since found out that they are rejects...however spazio refuse to accept responsibility and are adamant that they ar enot prepared to credit the already retured fittings.

i think its time to get wendy knowler..speak out or one of those tv programs to find out who is gona pay for this fiasco and who is repsonsible for the reject fittings stil on site

by the way...when you order spazio light fittings they have a 3 week waiting period for some fittings...they say to be manufactured...but i somehow dont beleive this...i get the feeling that is the time it takes to deliver from china to SA...i could be wrong...in fac tif someone has the facts please let me know.

[adrianh]

Why don't you video tape what happens when you recieve these packages and open them. Then you can tell the reps to watch the entire affair on YouTube. I'm sure they will just be thrilled!

[murdock]

the cameras have just been installed...pity i didnt think of that at the time...i do have all the photos..for the report i have to compile...the part that peees me off is that i now have to waste time doing reports...i spent 2 days trying to sort out this fiasco on site...all money down the tube for me...i refuse to touch another spazio fitting until i see an order number in my bank account.

[murdock]

i contacted my supplier today to find out what is happening about the credit for the fittings returned...apparently they have insisted that the fittings are not in the original packaging...and are not interested in the fact that the fittings were supplied in damaged...

heres the joke...when i removed the first 2 fittings from the packaging...with one of the directors of the company as a witness...and found that both the fittings were not in a fit condition...i then contacted the rep...who then came to site "removed the fittings from the packaging" and attempted to repair the faulty fittings by taking part from one fitting to repair other fittings... he then left site leaving all the fitting on the table without repacking them...i then packed their fittings back into the packaging the fittings where supplied in and returned them to my supplier who then returned them to spazio...but spazio are refusing to credit the same fittings because they are not in the original packaging...

[murdock]

just to give you an idea of the condition of the fittings when they were delivered...this pic was taken as we started unloaded the delivery vehicle.

[murdock]

these fitting were supplied and both had exactly the same model number...can you see the difference...note the screws missing on the cover...i unpacked and repacked and sent back.

[murdock]

this is one of the fittings...removed from the original packaging just to show the rep the defect in their light fittings...i was then told that it was a factory fault and i had to just drill a hole so that the plastic clip would fit into the new hole...yeah right...the other problem was that ou cannot remove the end cap because it some places the glue they stuck the covers on with is working so you have to break the end cap off to remove it...note the blob of glue to hold the end cap which didnt work in this case.

[murdock]

a better view of the issue with the end cap...

[AndyD]

Those boxes look pitiful. If someone delivered anything that looked like that at one of my sites the whole order would be returned immediately. If they came with the finger pointing and the 'no returns' policy you describe they'd be dealing directly with our lawyers long before the stage you're at.

Did you buy directly from Spazio? Did Spazio deliver or was it your courier?

Spazio used to be one step up from the bargain basement lighting such as Radiant, Eurolux, Brightstar etc. I've used their products on several occasions and was never a big fan. I always thought they weren't particularly good value for money and you could often buy higher quality fittings at similar prices if you did your homework but they were often specified for clients who didn't know any better (and usually thought they were Italian because of the name) by lazy architects because they generally filled the gap between the bottom end and high end European brands.

[murdock]

i have had numerous requests from customers to refer a lighting supplier...unfortunately all the good quality suppliers have closed down or no longer trade in sa... due to people not wanting to spend the money on good quality products or have also moved to getting their products made in china to be able to compete with the rest of the market...zumtobel comes to mind and lascon lighting...

any suggestions andy?

the project i have just complete we used trunking manufactured in germany and legrand plugs...what a pleasure installing a quality product.

[murdock]

spazio management are now saying that this issue has not been respolved because i was rude to their manager...mmm...my response...please put everything in written with immediate effect...and make sure you get your fact straight because i havent even spoken to spazio yet...and have decided not to just in case i do loose my rag and say something i shouldnt and end up all over the net and sponsorship with drawn etc ...i look forward to their response in writting.

[murdock]

what i expected to be a simple...return...refund...has turned nasty...when a company uses being rude as reason for not refunding thousands of rands...indicates 3 things to me...either spazio in in the financial dwang and cant afford to refund the money...or they are trying to stall to make the books look good for the month end...or they know something i dont...

the way i see this matter...i have witnesses and i have pictures...what more do i need.

question...this should be simple

i order lights...they deliever...their rep removes the fittings from the packaging...attempts to fix their defective fittings...the rep then has to order more more fittings which are delivered but still cannot get the quantity we ordered in working order...so the customer refuses to accept them and we repack the fittings left lying all over the counters by the spazio rep into the same packaging they were supplied in...which the rep removed from the packaging...and we return via the same route we recieved...when i enquire about the credit...i am told there are 2 reasons why i have not received my credit...first reason was because the fittings where not in the original packaging and now i am told that it is because i spoke to the manager at spazio in a rude manner....lets say i was rude...maybe i was sleep waking and called them and dont remeber...does this warrant grounds for them to hold back a refund?

my first question is this like a joke or something...is this for real.

where do i go from here...

do i get a lawyer and go the legal route...do i even have a case here or am i just blowing smoke?

do i just not pay my account with my supplier and leave it up to them to sue me for the money?

do i go to the cpa and file a complaint...does this actually work...or is it just like another useless goverment department?

but most important...i have generated and invoice for my time...telephone calls...meetings...etc...for just over R9000 ex vat...can i now put in a claim...considering i get paid by the hour...would i first need an order number...how would i go about now claiming for my time?

does the customer have the right to insist that all the reject fittings already installed be replaced at spazios cost or can we remove the fitting which have already been installed and refturn them for a credit plus costs to remove...considering that the fittings have been mounted and there is no longer original packaging.

andy to answer your question about the delivery...spazio deleivered the fittings to my supplier who then delivered to the site...i returned the fittings via the same route.

in 30 plus years of contracting have i ever had to deal with such an unproffessional company...i have never had equipment delivered in with so many defects...and in such horrific condition.

[Justloadit]

Hi Murdock,

Your supplier is the one supposed to be doing the arguments with Spazio not you.
You ordered from your supplier, and he delivered, you returned the goods to your supplier due to defects, your supplier must refund you. It is not your duty to argue with the manufacturer, that is your suppliers responsibility, he was after all your representative.

The only problem here is that you will no longer have servive from your supplier due to this issue.

I would go and visit your suppliers CEO with all the evidence you have, and get him involved to clear it up. Going this route will ensure that they will service you as a customer in future.

[murdock]

i have just received a reply...with some pics.

this is the part you got to love.

"i must say i find it difficult to believe that the entire supply of lighting did not meet with thier approval" eeeh hello did you see the pics?

"in light of their dis-satifaction, we agree to accept return of the fittings, PROVIDED, they are returned in their original pacakging and in a (this is the part i enjoyed the most ) resaleable condition" ...they expect me to accept this fittings in the condition they deleivered them to me... as indicated in the pics above... yet they are not prepared to accpet them back in the same condition...eeeish.

[Dave A]

and in a (this is the part i enjoyed the most ) resaleable condition"

Just reply that they are being returned because they weren't received in a saleable condition in the first place. If they would like you to fix their defective product, they can ask for a quote