Patent sale

[Greig Whitton]

I have been to the IDC but they explained that they have recently been burned by investing with somebody who patented a pool cleaner...

From what you have described, the IDC probably isn't the best fit source of financing for you. Are you already manufacturing and selling these pool cleaners? (if only on a small scale) If so, there are some DTI grant funds that you may qualify for. Alternatively, the enterprise development funding that I mentioned in a previous post may very well be a good fit or one of the smaller entrepreneurial funding initiatives. You're welcome to PM me if you would like to discuss your options.

The problem is that there are many pool cleaners on the market and most of them get the same job done.

My product out classes anything in the market currently and saves the user time and frustrations and I suppose at the end of the day money too.

How, exactly, does your product outclass the competition in terms of market benefits that customers care about enough to pay for as opposed to technical features? Why should someone who already has an inferior pool cleaner switch to your product, bearing in mind that you don't (yet) have a well established (i.e. trusted) brand?

Perseverance is the key to success I suppose...

Perseverance alone is often the key to failure. Too many entrepreneurs persevere with flawed ideas / plans / assumptions to the point of total ruin because subscribing to the "Field of Dreams" fallacy is easier than swallowing their pride and admitting that they might be wrong. Perseverance + awareness + adaptability is the key to success.

[adrianh]

The pool industry is one of those terribly cutthroat industries. I was heavily involved with led pool lighting before it became mainstream. We used to buy lots of aimflows from the big boys but once they caught on to what we doing with them they suddenly ran out of stock. They then got their own buddies to manufacture the lights. Another thing that happened was that they played us against another manufacturer telling each of us that the other could supply at an ever lower price. I decided to get out of the market because margins became so low that there was simply no point in continuing. Pool lighting is one of the most saturated markets now that the big boys have eliminated the little guys.

Many injection moulding companies are happy to fund the cost of the mould is amortized over a number of moulded products. The proviso is that the mould stays with them and they have exclusivity to do the moulding for you.

Another problem is that once your product is successful there will be many other similar products flooding the market from elsewhere. How do you stop 10 Chinese companies from making and selling your product? We live in an age of rapid prototying and 3D printing where anything can be duplicated and produced on a massive scale. Injection moulding companies have been milking the industry for far too long. They charge R120K for an injection mould because they always had the upper hand....those days are at their end.

Does your product work on pools outside of South Africa? Our market is tiny.

[Justloadit]

He who owns the supply chain, owns the market.

The big boys have deep pockets, and can afford to run at a loss on a specific product line, if only to crush the competition.
They also have the resources to put a product to market, even if it means copying some one. Their attitude is that they will defend in court, and drag the case for as long as humanly possible, and by then the small guy has folded.

[AndyD]

He who owns the supply chain, owns the market.

The big boys have deep pockets, and can afford to run at a loss on a specific product line, if only to crush the competition.
They also have the resources to put a product to market, even if it means copying some one. Their attitude is that they will defend in court, and drag the case for as long as humanly possible, and by then the small guy has folded.

Which brings us full circle back to the value of patents to anyone other than lawyers.

[adrianh]

Which brings us full circle back to the value of patents to anyone other than lawyers.

Zip!

[adrianh]

I looked at your disjointed disorganized site and all I get is that you sell flip flops and have some convoluted ideal about software, money and fishing. ...and you want people to sign an NDA agreement... good one!

[Justloadit]

Another drawback of patents is that it has to be placed in the public domain with full disclosure and it has a limited lifespan of protection - 16 years. There after it is public domain. Any variation to the original patent is no longer protected by the original patent.

There is a reason why Coca Cola never patented their recipe, and simply registered the Trade Mark

[BusFact]

I looked at your disjointed disorganized site and all I get is that you sell flip flops and have some convoluted ideal about software, money and fishing. ...and you want people to sign an NDA agreement... good one!

Makes you look drunk, when they delete the post you are referring to

[BusFact]

Another drawback of patents is that it has to be placed in the public domain with full disclosure and it has a limited lifespan of protection - 16 years. There after it is public domain. Any variation to the original patent is no longer protected by the original patent.

Exactly. You're pretty much telling every potential competitor how to make your product. So if you don't have the finances to defend your rights, its useless. In addition, the likes of China don't necessarily recognise patent protection.

[Gfacius]

Another drawback of patents is that it has to be placed in the public domain with full disclosure and it has a limited lifespan of protection - 16 years.

Patents give you protection for 20 Years from date of filing a Full Patent, and yes you cannot deviate from the specification of what was filed originally when making the product unless, like my attorneys (DMK) they have allowed for certain changes to be done to the product. So I am very confident that it wont be copied in this country in any event.

How do you stop 10 Chinese companies from making and selling your product?

The fact is a S.A. Patent will protect you in the sense that if you have competitors that are out to screw you in S.A, can very well get the product made outside S.A but then cannot bring it in to S.A. for re-sale. He will then have to sell it in other countries rather but by then China has jumped them on this anyway... I agree Patents are very tricky but feel that if you have the patent number etched somewhere on the product will work well to deter any competition from copying it.

My Patent out classes all competition when it comes to the particular product because it is not a Pool Cleaner but a "Weir Basket" Patent No. 2009/07570

The difference with mine is that when you remove the weir basket from the weir, the basket comes with the Lid. ie. The basket and lid are interlocked together thereby ensuring the leaves and debris stays in the basket while removing it. Also when you throw out the leaves the basket is easier to clean in that the smaller heavier stones that were picked up by the pool cleaner from the bottom of the pool doesn't block the holes on the bottom of the basket as these holes are smaller but are larger as you go up allowing for suction to be maintained when the basket is full of leaves so it won't strain the pump.

The other 2 critical issues improved on with this product is the aperture for the pool cleaner pipe is longer so grips better and minimizes the chance of the pipe disconnecting from the vacuum lid when the pool cleaner is running.

Also the interlocking protrusions ensure that the vacuum lid is securely locked in the weir and will not come out through on and off operation of the pump.
The other Patent (2011/02595) is a pump basket brush which stays in the pump basket during the pool pump operation to facilitate the cleaning of the basket.
The 3rd Patent "Pool Device"(2011/02891) stops the backward water pressure (when the pump switches off) from pushing the debris in the pump basket back towards the weir. This is especially for pools with solar panels as the water has to drain back to the pool and often blows all the muck back to the weir and into the pool. The great thing here is that it works with a floating plastic ball and is also fitted into the Pump basket and also acts as a handle to insert and remove the basket too.

Below is the 3 products Patented. The Brush and "pool device" are prototype samples. The end product for the brush will have a lot more bristles to improve cleaning of the pump basket.

[adrianh]

Wow, you don't mess around, well done.

I am sure that you must have bet the farm on the product.

[IanF]

Where can you see and buy the product?

[Gfacius]

Where can you see and buy the product?

Eartheco but they are mainly manufacturers and mass distributors only so I doubt they would sell you one.
We are trying to get it into builders warehouse for now as they were keen on stocking it but require that it is made to fit other older type weirs as well...So I'll keep you posted on this.
We did have it in some pool shops around Gauteng but as stated previously pissed off the main suppliers and they stopped this. There is some pool shops that are still waiting for me to supply them but am holding back because of builders etc.

You can PM me and I will gladly supply you but must remember it only fits the "Quality" & "Eartheco" type weir for now.

Pools Inc out in the East Rand also had them but he could not get stock from us as we changed the tooling at some point to fit the Eartheco weir as well. They have commented on their website that it has been discontinued (because he couldn't get stock). I need to supply him again with the new ones...

I need to get moving again with this but feel overwhelmed with all that must be done and done the right way. I am not one for negotiating etc but rather a designer. At the same time I need to keep the food on the table by running my other business and find it difficult to spend the time required on this. Very bad I know!

[CLIVE-TRIANGLE]

At the same time I need to keep the food on the table by running my other business and find it difficult to spend the time required on this. Very bad I know!

I would say you are doing both rather well! It makes my day to read a positive attitude / post !

[IanF]

Gfacuis my pool was built 25 years ago so not sure what weir it has, I bought a normal basket the other day and it fitted