Business Hijacking

[Dave A]

Once the end of this expose is reached, I am considering exposing the real names of the actors in this hijacking. This may be profoundly useful to other future potential victims, of this gang.

Will think through the pro's & con's of this, before making a final decision.

That's certainly a BIG decision and I sincerely hope you do give it some very careful thought. You may also want to read this thread relating to defamation for some possibly useful insight.

[desA]

Thanks Dave - your points are well received.

What is incredibly interesting is how business hijackers can actually do anything they feel like, but when the victim begins push-back, then he/she becomes the aggressor - the 'bad' one. My suspicion is that SA Law is not really able to properly understand (too immature) & apportion responsibility & criminality in such 'complex' matters. It is way easier to simply deal with defamation.

This too, is a tactic used by successful business hijackers in SA. It is really a deflection of blame onto other parties, instead of themselves. This too, is the mark of an abuser, oddly-enough.

Other cultures deal with hijacking matters at a very early stage through social mechanisms - generally not requiring involvement of courts. In my view, South Africa perhaps needs to step back a few steps towards tribal laws, where community responsibility is more prominent.

[desA]

Advice to the international business community
My advice to would-be international investors in SA, is that they order their affairs very, very carefully. Many SA operators are simply not trustworthy in terms of partnership, or joint-venture agreements - especially in terms of engineered products. I have observed that many so-called partners will sign an agreement, having already determined how to safely extricate themselves under protection of a devious attorney - taking full advantage of South Africa's poor legal system. Be warned!

The fact that many previous country-to-SA agreements required the SA government to underwrite/protect major investments, have lapsed, with deflection now towards the South African Courts for restitution - presents huge problems for the international party/ies. Again, be most wary! (Case in point - Switzerland-SA).

In terms of technology transfer, my advice would be to treat South Africa in similar vein to say Nigeria. Send only legacy technology, or that which has 'served its time' abroad & is towards the end of its product life cycle. Your IP is almost impossible to protect - even in South Africa. In this sense, it is similar to the rest of Africa - despite promises to the contrary by leading local IP attorneys. Your test in an SA court will generally be protracted & at great expense - with little real guarantee of success. Be warned!

[Dave A]

Des, I think you'll find getting justice can be quite a slog in near all countries that submit to the principles of "justice through courts of law" and "innocent until proven guilty". And the difficulties that are posed are not without good reason - it's to protect the innocent that are falsely accused from suffering injustice.

It's all too easy to encourage swift social justice when you feel you are wronged and you are confident you have the right people in your sights. But that same principle doesn't work well at all when somebody stands falsely accused. To my mind this means promoting the principle is... not particularly advisable.

I have to agree with you though in terms of pointing out the benefits of a "prevention is better than cure" mindset. Of course, sometimes you just can't see the problem coming.
(Which is probably why experience is such a valuable asset).

[Greig Whitton]

My advice to would-be international investors in SA, is that they order their affairs very, very carefully. Many SA operators are simply not trustworthy in terms of partnership, or joint-venture agreements - especially in terms of engineered products. I have observed that many so-called partners will sign an agreement, having already determined how to safely extricate themselves under protection of a devious attorney - taking full advantage of South Africa's poor legal system. Be warned!

On the off chance that any prospective international investors do read this thread, please consider desA's opinion in the context of his personal legal battles and subsequent disillusionment with South Africa's legal system. There are many trustworthy South African entrepreneurs and business partners who would welcome your interest in our country. Obviously there is also a corrupt, criminal element - as there is in any country - and a thorough due diligence should be conducted as normal.

Your IP is almost impossible to protect - even in South Africa.

This is factually incorrect as evident from publicly available court judgments.

Your test in an SA court will generally be protracted & at great expense - with little real guarantee of success.

Institutional justice is rarely quick, inexpensive, and guaranteed. South Africa is not unique in this respect.

[Greig Whitton]

Des, I think you'll find getting justice can be quite a slog in near all countries that submit to the principles of "justice through courts of law" and "innocent until proven guilty". And the difficulties that are posed are not without good reason - it's to protect the innocent that are falsely accused from suffering injustice.

It's all too easy to encourage swift social justice when you feel you are wronged and you are confident you have the right people in your sights. But that same principle doesn't work well at all when somebody stands falsely accused.

Amen.

[desA]

DaveA & Greg, your comments are welcomed. I have to respectfully disagree with many of your views. Respectfully - much of this probably stems from spending most of your business life in South Africa. A dose of local myopia, denial & wishful thinking, perhaps? This is to be understood. It is normal.

I'd suggest perhaps reviewing international norms - perhaps even extended periods of time abroad. It is only when you live in other countries for a period of time, & understand their norms, that the true situation on the ground, in South Africa, becomes clear.

The South Africa most of us understood when we grew up, no longer exists. We grew up in an emerging society, where many norms were still being established. Things are now different! When you have senior Advocates & Attorneys relaying anecdotal evidence of functional anarchy within the Criminal & Civil Court System itself, then you may want to re-think. SA is now well & truly - Africa, make no bones about it.

The learning curve I went through in SA during 2013/2014 was astounding & something I'm absolutely sure no foreign national/company would want to go through. Before these events, I had lived abroad for a long period & had travelled through some 30+ countries, over the years. In essence, I had returned to take care of family matters - with a mentality more akin to that of a foreign national. As the story unfolds further, the die-hard SA supporters will have to question their local world view.

[Dave A]

Des, you know what? I'm so happy in my own little world right now, I'm more than comfortable with letting your last post slide as a by-product of your bad experience.

The learning curve I went through in SA during 2013/2014 was astounding & something I'm absolutely sure no foreign national/company would want to go through.

So my apologies for interrupting your flow of thoughts. Quite clearly this is something you need to get off your chest. And I suspect the sooner the better.

Please continue your story.

[Greig Whitton]

Respectfully - much of this probably stems from spending most of your business life in South Africa. A dose of local myopia, denial & wishful thinking, perhaps?

Your arrogant assumptions are neither respectful nor accurate.

Perhaps we could get back to your business hijacking experience and cease the purposeful discouragement of foreign investment? We're 12 pages into this thread and I've yet to learn how the hijacking occurred and how you have attempted to resolve it.

[desA]

Seem to have touched a few raw nerves, I see - often the concepts are jarring. The SA mindset can be rather different - we are a by-product of our environment - norms, value-system, tolerance, aggressiveness etc.

Folks, be aware that the SA many of us knew, is not really what we thought, despite how much we would like to think so. Many of us grew up either around the early stages of bent Verwoerd's ideologies, or in its aftermath. We saw systems emerging around us, & in many ways approximated a first world system. Right on our own doorstep was a third-world system, with its own set of norms & rules (often different to 'ours'). This system has essentially overtaken the first-world system we had - a reality of Africa.

The problem is that the business hijackers in SA, take full advantage of this difficulty - chinks in the legal armour. Allowing for this change in future business plans - coupled with careful business structures - pre start-up, is vitally important. A war-chest needs to be allocated well ahead of time, for defense of member's/owners interests. I have tested this notion with attorneys & advocates.

Some of my thoughts stem from a review of the experiences I went through. If they don't resonate, please ignore them. Perhaps they don't warrant a fierce defense, or angry response. Different minds see the world in different ways - thus leading to a rich tapestry. Difference is good!

Will proceed with the rest of the story, going forwards.

[flaker]

Quote: "Folks, be aware that the SA many of us knew, is not really what we thought, despite how much we would like to think so. Many of us grew up either around the early stages of bent Verwoerd's ideologies, or in its aftermath. We saw systems emerging around us, & in many ways approximated a first world system" desA



That, yes that was what was wrong. that is what bred what we experience now. Colonisation. Screwed up the whole of Africa.Some of us still choose to do business here in S.A. and live reasonably well, within its constraints

[desA]

^ Fair-enough comment, flaker.

For me, personally, the most frightening part of the whole sad affair has been the blatant abuse & gaming of what remains of the SA criminal & legal system. Were adequate, or certainly more robust systems in place, SA would stand a better chance of making the cultural & ideological conversion into the African paradigm.

Sidebar:
The interesting thing I find about crossing international borders into SE Asia is that many officials are surprised to see a light-green South African - I kid you not. Everyone knows that SA has dark-green people. It generally ends up in a history lesson about SA's present demographics.

[desA]

(cont).

Topics to follow:
- NuCo concept/structure/focus
- Relationship between NuCo & G&B
- Agreement for transfer of TransX IP, brand/trademark from G&B to NuCo
- Signing of Distribution Agreement between NuCo & G&B
- Internal arrangements within NuCo - member structure
- Trading begins for NuCo
- Questions arise wrt NuCo Trading Turnover after 4 months
- Financial fraud within NuCo
- G&B Distribution Agreement forgery - in conjunction with SAXO
- Impasse
- The hijack fleecer enters
- Pressure builds on both sides
- Hijack is effected - method/fraud/stand-off
- SAPS fraud case for R3 million lodged - case in progress
- Hijackers attempt to bully desA to sign out of NuCo - abusing court 'backing' - commit R12 million fraud in process
- SARS complaint - online & in person
- CIPC - lodgement of hijacking matter
- CIPC - interesting outcomes
- Trademark blocks - hijackers will have future difficulties disposing/owning
- The SA civil legal system - kissing cousins & incestuous relationships
- ...
- Further review points right up to present.

To foreign viewers of this thread - Be very, very careful when attempting to do business in South Africa. Invest/spend what you would be prepared to lose in a casino - enjoy the thrill of win-or-lose, with the house stacked against you.

[pmbguy]

You are on a South African business forum saying that SA businesses are a bunch of crooks. You go one further and discourage investors from abroad. You claim your thread is about helping people...I say you are doing much more harm than good.

I have never seen such well written nonsense before. You think that your experience is a microcosm of all business in SA...your'e delusional

[Greig Whitton]

You are on a South African business forum saying that SA businesses are a bunch of crooks. You go one further and discourage investors from abroad. You claim your thread is about helping people...I say you are doing much more harm than good.

Amen.