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Thread: Working late

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    Working late

    Hi guys,

    I already have feedback from the RMI on what I can do to this guy, but thought I'd get your take on it as well.

    Our office hours are from 08:00 to 17:00. So last night one of my guys packs away his tools at 17h00 and leaves, while the vehicle he was working on was not done. Now I have to ask one of the other guys to please finish his job, as the customer is standing waiting for his car...

    I feel this should go toward: "Undermining of the business" or "Bringing the company name into disrepute"

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    Diamond Member adrianh's Avatar
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    I would like to express two opposing opinions because I can see the issue from both sides:

    1. The employer (Yes I am also an employer so I understand your frustrations) expects the employee to finish the car the same day if the employee was expected to do so.
    2. The employee may have had an important prior arrangement (I am also a dad with two daughters and I often have to pick the girls up from school or skating or whatever).

    The problem as I see it is communication. The employee should be instructed to communicate with you or the customer at 16:30 if the car will not be finished in time. He should also communicate that he has prior arrangements that cannot be changed. This way everybody know where they stand.
    How easily someone is offended is directly proportional to how stupid they are.
    ~GS Elevator

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    There has been prior instances with this guy. He doesn't say a word, just packs up and leave. Sometimes I only notice he is gone 15 minutes after he has left.

    Firstly: I heeded the RMI's warning, and gave him a warning on another technicality, where he dissapeared to the shop after we told him to wait for a part we collected arouond the corner.

    Secondly: We pay some guys that are used to being paid weekly (from their previous employment) an "advance" on a weekly basis. Plus we allow some guys to borrow money. This particular guy regularly asks to leave early as well. So my conversation with him went as follows: By law he doesn't have to work after 17:00. But by law I don't have to pay him an advance, nor loan him money, nor do I have to allow him to leave early. So if he doesn't have to go the extra mile, neither do I...

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    Silver Member bones's Avatar
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    my opinion is that he worked till your
    closing time he really didnt do wrong

    my clients know my shop close at 6
    and i don't do business till next day

    i understand the car wasnt done but
    again he is following your rules unless
    you sit him down and speak to him

    i wouldnt go so far to give him any
    type of warning because he didnt do
    anything wrong

    just talking to the guy in a positive
    way will resolve this in my opinion

    employers have responsibility so
    does employees maybe he had to
    do stuff that was important maybe
    not but still he did nothing wrong
    seek professional help with anything and everything never take advice from me

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    Diamond Member adrianh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hannes Botha View Post
    There has been prior instances with this guy. He doesn't say a word, just packs up and leave. Sometimes I only notice he is gone 15 minutes after he has left.

    Firstly: I heeded the RMI's warning, and gave him a warning on another technicality, where he dissapeared to the shop after we told him to wait for a part we collected arouond the corner.

    Secondly: We pay some guys that are used to being paid weekly (from their previous employment) an "advance" on a weekly basis. Plus we allow some guys to borrow money. This particular guy regularly asks to leave early as well. So my conversation with him went as follows: By law he doesn't have to work after 17:00. But by law I don't have to pay him an advance, nor loan him money, nor do I have to allow him to leave early. So if he doesn't have to go the extra mile, neither do I...
    I had a similar employee. The one hand washed the other hand all the time. I finally got rid of him because we got tired of his k@k attitude and of us having to be his social worker / atm / garnishee order manager / nappy changer.
    How easily someone is offended is directly proportional to how stupid they are.
    ~GS Elevator

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    Silver Member bones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hannes Botha View Post
    There has been prior instances with this guy. He doesn't say a word, just packs up and leave. Sometimes I only notice he is gone 15 minutes after he has left.

    Firstly: I heeded the RMI's warning, and gave him a warning on another technicality, where he dissapeared to the shop after we told him to wait for a part we collected arouond the corner.

    Secondly: We pay some guys that are used to being paid weekly (from their previous employment) an "advance" on a weekly basis. Plus we allow some guys to borrow money. This particular guy regularly asks to leave early as well. So my conversation with him went as follows: By law he doesn't have to work after 17:00. But by law I don't have to pay him an advance, nor loan him money, nor do I have to allow him to leave early. So if he doesn't have to go the extra mile, neither do I...
    i hate this actually yes you do
    give him advance and borrow
    him money and allow him to go
    early

    the agreement is starting time
    till closing time if you pay him
    in advance that is your call if
    you give him loans that is your
    call if you want him to work
    later hours then overtime is
    fair

    at each instance you could
    have said no and not worry
    about repayments of loans
    people going home early
    or paying them advance

    you pay a worker to work
    follow the rules and expect
    them to be professional if
    they dont like it they can
    find other employment

    where this one hand washes
    the other thing comes from is
    beyond me business is
    business
    seek professional help with anything and everything never take advice from me

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    Quote Originally Posted by bones View Post
    i hate this actually yes you do
    give him advance and borrow
    him money and allow him to go
    early

    the agreement is starting time
    till closing time if you pay him
    in advance that is your call if
    you give him loans that is your
    call if you want him to work
    later hours then overtime is
    fair

    at each instance you could
    have said no and not worry
    about repayments of loans
    people going home early
    or paying them advance

    you pay a worker to work
    follow the rules and expect
    them to be professional if
    they dont like it they can
    find other employment

    where this one hand washes
    the other thing comes from is
    beyond me business is
    business
    I agree with bones on this one. Working hours is working hours. If you want him to stay and finish a job, overtime is payable.

    We as business owners often forget that employees do not have the same commitment to the business as we do.

  8. Thanks given for this post:

    bones (10-Mar-16)

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    Guys, overtime was never the issue. If my guys work 5 mins past 17:00, I pay them time and a half...

    "We as business owners often forget that employees do not have the same commitment to the business as we do"

    This is a shame...part of our company mission handed out and signed by all is a quote: "We don't pay your salary, the customer does. We just manage the money"

    Look at it from the customers point of view: This place is working on your car and you are standing waiting for it. Suddenly the technician packs up and leave, and you are left standing outside and told "Sorry sir, we close at 17:00"....would you ever go back there?

  10. Thanks given for this post:

    bones (11-Mar-16)

  11. #9
    Silver Member bones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hannes Botha View Post
    Guys, overtime was never the issue. If my guys work 5 mins past 17:00, I pay them time and a half...

    "We as business owners often forget that employees do not have the same commitment to the business as we do"

    This is a shame...part of our company mission handed out and signed by all is a quote: "We don't pay your salary, the customer does. We just manage the money"

    Look at it from the customers point of view: This place is working on your car and you are standing waiting for it. Suddenly the technician packs up and leave, and you are left standing outside and told "Sorry sir, we close at 17:00"....would you ever go back there?
    i agree with you really i do
    a stink attitude isnt right
    and really i would talk to
    all the employees about it

    tell them where they stand
    and refresh there memory
    why it is important to give
    the client the service they
    expect

    also warn them that you
    will not tolerate this type
    of behavior anymore and
    spell out what you expect
    form each of them

    if this behavior continues
    start the disciplinary
    process

    loyalty means nothing to
    people nor does
    commitment

    but rules count so make
    your rules work for you if
    they dont like it there are
    thousands of people that
    will take there place under
    your employment
    seek professional help with anything and everything never take advice from me

  12. #10
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    This is not as simple a problem as meets the eye. This is probably a huge communication (as someone has mentioned) and attitude problem. Questions you need to ask yourself are: When the car was booked in, was there a realistic expectation that the car could be finished before 17h00? When the employee received the job card/instruction, was there realistically enough time to finish the job? Were all spares, tool, equipment readily available to finish the job in the expected time frame? Was there a pre-arrangement with the employee regarding finishing the job, even if it goes beyond 17h00? Was the situation explained to the customer, that the job may not be finished before 17h00? Does the employee have the opportunity to challenge your decision to take on a job when there won't be sufficient time to finish it?

    Bad attitude begins somewhere, at home, issues with kids, substance abuse, intimidation, workplace dissatisfaction, personality differences with immediate supervisor, perceived unfulfilled ambitions etc. There is not much in terms of legal requirement, that obligates an employer to get to the bottom of it, but those who do, more often than not, turn a problem employee into a star employee with relatively small input.

  13. Thanks given for this post:

    Dave A (12-Mar-16)

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