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Thread: Child killed by washing machine

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    Email problem 123's Avatar
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    Child killed by washing machine

    Another tragedy

    a simple R300 Lear E/leakage could have prevented this, just so tragic...
    If it is not broken, fix/test it until it is.
    This is my opinion and I stick to it.

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    Site Caretaker Dave A's Avatar
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    And old, unaltered installations without an earth leakage unit are still "reasonably safe"?

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    Email problem 123's Avatar
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    Old, Existing installations, to my knowledge, and according to EIR 2009, should comply to Clause 5 of Sans 10142, which clearly refers to Earthleakage Protection on Socket outlets only?
    If it is not broken, fix/test it until it is.
    This is my opinion and I stick to it.

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    Email problem 123's Avatar
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    Correction, I have again read the EIR of 2009, and it does not refer to "old" or "unaltered". It only refers to "existing installations", which must comply to Clause 5 (General Safety Principles) only. The coc refers to "reasonably safe", but the law sees it as "reasonably safe" when the installation complies with the general safety principles, which of course is clause 5 only in the sans 10142.

    Anyway, a freakin working and correctly wired cheap E/Leakage, if tested regularly via a little pushbutton, could have saved this tiny life, and the parents from a lifetime of sorrow.
    Last edited by 123; 18-Jan-11 at 06:59 AM. Reason: spelling
    If it is not broken, fix/test it until it is.
    This is my opinion and I stick to it.

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    simply doing a bit of maintenance by replacing the cable could have saved the childs life...

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    Quote Originally Posted by 123 View Post
    Correction, I have again read the EIR of 2009, and it does not refer to "old" or "unaltered". It only refers to "existing installations", which must comply to Clause 5 (General Safety Principles) only. The coc refers to "reasonably safe", but the law sees it as "reasonably safe" when the installation complies with the general safety principles, which of course is clause 5 only in the sans 10142.

    Anyway, a freakin working and correctly wired cheap E/Leakage, if tested regularly via a little pushbutton, could have saved this tiny life, and the parents from a lifetime of sorrow.
    the sans code is merely a set of guide lines...what you do with your electrical installation and who you use to wire and maintain the installation is your decision...if iyou recomend that people install an E/L unit if it there isnt one and they choose not to install it and something happens it has nothing to do with the regulations.

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    Site Caretaker Dave A's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 123 View Post
    Correction, I have again read the EIR of 2009, and it does not refer to "old" or "unaltered". It only refers to "existing installations", which must comply to Clause 5 (General Safety Principles) only. The coc refers to "reasonably safe", but the law sees it as "reasonably safe" when the installation complies with the general safety principles, which of course is clause 5 only in the sans 10142.
    I've just checked with my sparkies and that's the way we're applying it too. If the client wants a COC on their electrical installation, there has to be earth leakage protection on the plug points*.

    Thank goodness it changed. Now we just need to get to all the properties that haven't got earth leakage units installed yet for whatever reason.

    *ignoring the issue of dedicated socket outlets for the sake of simplicity in this discussion.
    Quote Originally Posted by murdock View Post
    simply doing a bit of maintenance by replacing the cable could have saved the childs life...
    Absolutely
    Quote Originally Posted by murdock View Post
    the sans code is merely a set of guide lines...what you do with your electrical installation and who you use to wire and maintain the installation is your decision...if iyou recomend that people install an E/L unit if it there isnt one and they choose not to install it and something happens it has nothing to do with the regulations.
    That point goes a bit deeper than it might seem at first glance.

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but when an accredited person issues a COC, that installation (or portion of the installation), must comply with SANS codes.

    However, where no COC is issued such as in maintenance work...

    Should COCs be required for maintenance work?

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    for the record...when i wire up a kitchen...laundry...i dont connect appliances like the washing machine...tumble dryer...dishwasher to the e/l unit...i install a seperate circuit from the db to an isolator and then connect the unit directly to the isolator...off the e/l unit..just like the stove...and make sure the units are all correctly earthed.

    and some people even request the deep freeze not connected to the e/l unit.

    earth leakage units where designed for portable appliaces like irons and stuff...most portable appliances are double insulated so they dont even require an earth.

    i dont have time to read the sans regs but i am sure there is or was a section about lights being higher than a specified height ...do not need to be earthed.

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    No COC required for maintenance work. You are not adding or altering the existing installation.

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    Correct. Arms reach is what you are refering to. 2.5m vertically. 1.25m downwards from the outer esdge of surface. 1.25m horiz0ntally outwards from the outer edges of of the surface. 0.75m horizontally inwards from the outer edges of the surface and underneath the surface. Earthing not required. See 3.5 of Sans 10142

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