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Thread: Pool pump DB, fixed appliance or sub DB

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave A View Post
    That's been my understanding, except using the term "control panel" when it is not a DB
    Could there also be a lockable isolator in the supplying DB rather than an isolator within arms reach of the control panel?
    (Yes. Yes. I know "lockable isolators" are another can of worms )
    In my opinion the isolator would need to be at the control box in the event of removal
    The pool guy is not a electrician and will be the one working on the appliance.
    Will he always be able to access the DB when he comes to carry out repairs ?

    Could reg below come into play ,


    6.16.5.1.4 Each motor shall be supplied by a manually operated disconnector
    or any other manually operated disconnecting arrangement such as a
    withdrawable circuit-breaker, a removable link, a fuse or by the removal of a
    plug from a socket-outlet, which provides at least the same isolating distance,
    for the sake of safety, as a disconnector that is
    a) readily accessible and mounted on or next to the motor, or
    b) visible from the motor, or
    c) lockable in the open position, or
    d) housed in a lockable enclosure other than a distribution board.


    5.3.7 Disconnecting devices
    An installation shall have disconnecting devices that allow the installation to
    be disconnected for maintenance, testing, fault detection or repair. In the case
    of circuits or items of equipment, additional disconnecting devices could be
    required to allow disconnection for maintenance, testing, fault detection or
    repair of such circuits or equipment.


    5.3.8 Positioning and accessibility of electrical equipment
    Electrical equipment shall be so positioned that
    a) it does not impair the functioning or safety of other equipment,
    b) it is readily accessible for installation, replacement, operation, testing,
    inspection, maintenance and repair (see 6.6.1.9 and 6.9.4 for the main
    switch). All parts of the installation shall be accessible without the need to
    enter any adjoining premises (for example, in an apartment building),
    NOTE Common areas (such as passages and entrance halls) are not regarded as
    adjoining areas.
    c) there is easy access to its location
    ,

  2. #12
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    I agree ... the double pole main switch of a "Pool DB" should be in a separate compartment or on the top of side of the pool DB or on the wall next to the pool pump/DB.

    The pool guy shouldnt be opening the pool/ Sub DB.

    It gets even more complicated ... because not all pool DB's are fed from an earth leakage ... some have the earth leakage installed in the pool DB.

    In reality the pool guy shouldnt be opening the pool DB .. .the pump has a socket outlet on the side of the DB (which is why earth leakage protection is required) however the pool light creates a challenge ... the transfomer should be in a separate compartment fed from a combo breaker/isolator and I seen a few with fuses for the transfomer.

    Then you have the other challenges were the pool lights are not fed from a pool DB and the pumps are part of a bigger setup.
    Comments are based on opinion...not always facts....that's why people use an alias.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ians View Post
    I agree ... the double pole main switch of a "Pool DB" should be in a separate compartment or on the top of side of the pool DB or on the wall next to the pool pump/DB.

    The pool guy shouldnt be opening the pool/ Sub DB.

    .
    If we do not want the pool guy opening the " pool motor control centre" , then we cannot say that the pool " DB" is a fixed appliance

    Can't have it both ways .

    Same a s a geyser - We want to call the geyser a fixed appliance and then want to stop the plumber from working on the fixed appliance
    A stove - Same story , stove technician opens it and plays with the electrical circuit , aircon etc.

    If we called it a fixed appliance then a fixed appliance can be worked on by the fixed appliance technician, In my opinion

  4. #14
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    What I meant in my comment is that there should be away to isolate the pool DB at the pool from the mains power ... a way to do that would be to separate the incoming power from the rest of the pool DB ... by means of a double pole isolator in close proximity.


    Fitting a lockable isolator in the DB creates a whole new set of challenges ... if technicians are going to work on fixed appliances ... then a separate isolator must be fitted next to the appliance or at least in the same room or roof space.
    Comments are based on opinion...not always facts....that's why people use an alias.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by ians View Post
    What I meant in my comment is that there should be away to isolate the pool DB at the pool from the mains power ... a way to do that would be to separate the incoming power from the rest of the pool DB ... by means of a double pole isolator in close proximity.


    Fitting a lockable isolator in the DB creates a whole new set of challenges ... if technicians are going to work on fixed appliances ... then a separate isolator must be fitted next to the appliance or at least in the same room or roof space.
    Agreed

  6. #16
    Site Caretaker Dave A's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GCE View Post
    In my opinion the isolator would need to be at the control box in the event of removal
    The pool guy is not a electrician and will be the one working on the appliance.
    Will he always be able to access the DB when he comes to carry out repairs ?

    Could reg below come into play ,


    6.16.5.1.4 Each motor shall be supplied by a manually operated disconnector
    or any other manually operated disconnecting arrangement such as a
    withdrawable circuit-breaker, a removable link, a fuse or by the removal of a
    plug from a socket-outlet, which provides at least the same isolating distance,
    for the sake of safety, as a disconnector that is
    a) readily accessible and mounted on or next to the motor, or
    b) visible from the motor, or
    c) lockable in the open position, or
    d) housed in a lockable enclosure other than a distribution board.
    Ah. The "motors" requirement for disconnecting devices. But isn't that why the pump motor is normally plugged into a socket outlet on the control panel?

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave A View Post
    Ah. The "motors" requirement for disconnecting devices. But isn't that why the pump motor is normally plugged into a socket outlet on the control panel?
    I have not seen that , the pump plugged in - I have seen the Pool " control box " plugged into a socket outlet

  8. #18
    Site Caretaker Dave A's Avatar
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    I did say the "lockable isolator in DB" was a can of worms

    But they are lockable and I don't recall the SANS code saying anything about "subject to general availability of locking devices".

    My favourite article on the subject remains this one on disconnecting devices by Cecil Lancaster.

  9. #19
    Site Caretaker Dave A's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GCE View Post
    I have not seen that , the pump plugged in - I have seen the Pool " control box " plugged into a socket outlet
    A few current options after a quick search.
    From ACDC
    From Voltex

    There's a model that's been used extensively in most domestic installations in Durban for many years. When I come across a photo of one, I must remember to post it.

  10. #20
    Gold Member Derlyn's Avatar
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    I have yet to see a pool db with an isolator on the supply in close proximity to the db.

    All those that I come across are sub db's.

    I prefer it that way because I charge per db when doing an inspection. More db's .... more moola. That's why I'm there in the first place.

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