Pump supply connected to City Power point of supply board

[kosmonooit]

Greetings,

Can I bounce something off you guys, who are up to speed with the domestic SANS codes.

Client of mine had an expensive pump & tank system fitted as a mains water backup, Joburg Northern suburbs. Top $ client. Fancy kit.

Its located by entrance gate and direct adjacent to the enclosure that has the City Power meter.

What the electrician who was called in to do the electrical work did is connected the small sub db they installed direct to the point of supply board, to one phase coming out the smart meter, via a single pole circuit breaker

My understanding is that this is not on and is non complaint with the 10142 codes, circuits have to be downstream of the main switch. There can only be one main switch. If you turn that off you expect all the circuits to be dead.

Reason why they did this: its right there, taking a cable to the house is work and expenses. And who would give a damn anyway.

Can anyone confirm or comment please. Thanks in advance.

I might need some help with a formal report from a Master Electrician who is around this area.

If this a problem, getting it sorted out is easy, but what about the guys that did this? There sticker is on the sub db box. I see soooo much horrible unsafe work around (that often gets CoC'sl), there really should be repercussions guys are getting away with it. Or is that the world we live in.

Thanks in advance.

[GCE]

It should be only one point of control to an installation

The easiest way around it is to create a main DB at the gate which then feeds the tanks and make the main DB in the dwelling a Sub DB

[GCE]

If this a problem, getting it sorted out is easy, but what about the guys that did this? There sticker is on the sub db box. I see soooo much horrible unsafe work around (that often gets CoC'sl), there really should be repercussions guys are getting away with it. Or is that the world we live in.

Thanks in advance.

Unfortunately it is the country we live in .
The custodians of the OHSA that ultimately controls the SANS 10142 have no will to carry out there work. It appears that top management within Department of Labour have no ability or will to get there staff to carry out anything that would be classed as normal work duties.

We have been through various routes to try and get some action out of the DOL and I had a meeting with the deputy director as to how they would want us to go around reporting and getting a case to prosecution.

We have a developer in town that builds numerous houses per month - The work is shocking .
We contracted the AIA's to come and inspect 3 or 4 of the units and the remark was that it was the worst work he had seen.
The " electrical contractor" is a handyman type guy in PE doing labour only , the signature on the COC is a over 70 and operates from Alberton in Gauteng and I doubt he knows where PE is.

The report was duly handed over to DOL and in the beginning there seemed to be some interest which quickly died - The developer continues unabated .
In this week it came to light that the surfix being used is being bought at a " general store" that imports from china - The surfix is copper coated metal and the volt drops across the surfix exceed the code .
Further to the discovery we now found out that there is a cable that appears to be T&E being sold at these general stores which is also copper coated steel wire .
The " T& E " is actually labeled 300/500v SANS 1507 speaker wire - ( obviously to import without repercussions ) but is identical to T&E

The only way to tell is to use a magnet which is now going to have to be a new tool added to the test equipment briefcase

Yet the department keep bringing out new regulations and changing regulations - For what I have no idea , because they have no intention of policing them

[ians]

I agree with GCE ... I would fit a weather proof "main DB" at the gate ... using a circuit breaker with isolating properties at the main switch (so that you dont have to fit a main switch then a circuit breaker to feed the house) wired with the correct size wiring. then a double pole combo breaker which will serve as an isolator/ protection breaker (if it is a single phase booster pump) or an earth leakage with overload protection.

If it is 3 phase ... then the correct isolation and protection would apply.

You dont need a master electrician to sign off the work ... an installation electrician would be able to fill out the test report and issue a COC ... if it is compliant.

If I were the customer ... I would expect to see at least a single line diagram indicating the basic layout of the site ... show the location of the DB's.

To give you an idea of what we offer our customers

A single line diagram of the electrical installation which indication the location of the DB ... the size of the cable feeding the DB ... where it is fed from.

A set of drawing with every single plug point with a label ... which includes the DB number ... the circuit number and the number of the actual point for example

DB1-P1/1

Fed from DB 1 ... plug circuit 1 ... plug number 1 ... by looking at this you know that socket has the feed from the DB.

A breakdown of the DB

DB 1 - Plug circuit 1 - plug 1 - washing machine
Plug 2 deep freeze

the same with the lights ... stove ... geyser etc

The electrical backup system .... solar/inverter/ batteries or if it is a just a backup

Then you get a breakdown of the alarm system ... with all the details down to each remote ... the number of the remote the code for the remote .. .who is allocated the remote ... a copy of the full setup of the alarm is downloaded and stored as a backup if the alarm PCB needs to be replaced

each zone ... the setup ... which partition ... etc ... which cameras a re linked to which zones ... all the info about the security light connected to the alarm ... the remotes which arm disarm the system and activate the security lghts ... even the location of the junction boxes and lights.

Who is linked to the alarm and camera app ... which informs you who arms and disarms the system .. .the status of the system.

The same with the CCTV ...

The info regarding the network cables including any WiFi extenders and any smart devices connected to the system.

Safety zones with means to activate silent panic alarms in case the person in the house is cornered and cant access panic button.

a code word used on in cases of emergency ... for example you get hijacked and your partner contacts you if you use that word it they will know you are in trouble ... same thing is the kids is separated from mom or dad they just shout that word ... of if you are in the garden ... you know if that person says that word there is a big problem.

Totally off subject but during this time of year ... you need to be extra vigilant ... women need to beware while shopping getting robbed at gun in a busy store is becoming a common practice ... they will surround you ... threaten you while they remove all your personal belongings ... or snatch phones and stuff off the table ... beware people its crazy season.

[Derlyn]

Unfortunately it is the country we live in .
The custodians of the OHSA that ultimately controls the SANS 10142 have no will to carry out there work. It appears that top management within Department of Labour have no ability or will to get there staff to carry out anything that would be classed as normal work duties.

We have been through various routes to try and get some action out of the DOL and I had a meeting with the deputy director as to how they would want us to go around reporting and getting a case to prosecution.

We have a developer in town that builds numerous houses per month - The work is shocking .
We contracted the AIA's to come and inspect 3 or 4 of the units and the remark was that it was the worst work he had seen.
The " electrical contractor" is a handyman type guy in PE doing labour only , the signature on the COC is a over 70 and operates from Alberton in Gauteng and I doubt he knows where PE is.

The report was duly handed over to DOL and in the beginning there seemed to be some interest which quickly died - The developer continues unabated .
In this week it came to light that the surfix being used is being bought at a " general store" that imports from china - The surfix is copper coated metal and the volt drops across the surfix exceed the code .
Further to the discovery we now found out that there is a cable that appears to be T&E being sold at these general stores which is also copper coated steel wire .
The " T& E " is actually labeled 300/500v SANS 1507 speaker wire - ( obviously to import without repercussions ) but is identical to T&E

The only way to tell is to use a magnet which is now going to have to be a new tool added to the test equipment briefcase

Yet the department keep bringing out new regulations and changing regulations - For what I have no idea , because they have no intention of policing them

Yes. "Chinatown" T&E. With 2 Chinatowns in East London selling the crap, Xolani and I are having to replace more and more of it as each month passes.

At least once every 2 months Xolani goes to visit his grandmother in the Transkei and tells me that 90% of the cable sold there is Chinatown gemors.
Someone is making loads of money because it costs more there than what the right stuff costs here.

Same with all building materials ...... fencing, roof sheeting, window frames etc. The cheap Chinese gemors is being dumped there and those people pay more than what we pay for top quality here. Criminal behaviour.

Peace out .. Derek.

[ians]

A free tip ... to test if the cable is copper or tinned copper (alarm cables ... not sure if it will work on twin) ... strip back a piece of insulation ... take a lighter and burn it ... if the wire glows red and doesnt melt or fold down its pure copper cable ... if it melts ... its tinned copper.

I see a lot of tinned copper being used in the CCTV industry.