Bad attitude

[Greig Whitton]

The problem with going straight to dismissal is:

1. It's (arguably) excessive;
2. The employee has not been afforded a reasonable opportunity to change her behaviour in line with conduct standards; and
3. By OP's own admission, previous complaints about her attitude have (seemingly) been tolerated.

A formal disciplinary hearing + final written warning + anger management / relationship management training sounds like the most sensible response.

Do you have a workplace policy detailing standards of conduct as well as disciplinary consequences for failing to adhere to those requirements? If not, implement one. While it's not a legal requirement, it can make it a lot easier to justify dismissal should it come to that.

[roryf]

when the CCMA gets involved sometimes the question is
asked what the employer did to help the employee then
the dismissal gets messy i recommend to contact
someone that knows the labour laws and can give you
proper advice dont go on what people say get the fact
make sure the dismissal is fair first

Bones,I would fight this one in the CCMA if the employee did take it further.Something are worth fighting for,but like I said each to their own.My workplace/business and how it is run is a reflection on me.

[Dave A]

My staff know exactly what would happen to them if this happened in my workplace.

In that situation you probably wouldn't have a problem moving to dismissal.

In the circumstances described by the op though, I agree with Greig.

A formal disciplinary hearing + final written warning + anger management / relationship management training sounds like the most sensible response.

[Citizen X]

Imagine if the customer or a bystander had filmed the exchange and posted it on Facebook or Youtube. It very easily cause the very quick demise of your business.

How very true

[Citizen X]

The RMI suggests I do not dismiss, but give her a final written warning. I would like to ad soft skills training to that, but not sure which...Sales...Dealing with difficult people...?

I see a common problem that many employers have, they don't have a customised disciplinary code and procedure in place. Employers are responsible for administrative justice in their businesses, subject to the LRA. To do so effectively an employer should have a disciplinary code and procedure in place.subject to the LRA, some rules are so common that all employees are expected to be aware of them. It can only harm an employer not to have a proper disciplinary code and procedure in place.

[roryf]

I see a common problem that many employers have, they don't have a customised disciplinary code and procedure in place. Employers are responsible for administrative justice in their businesses, subject to the LRA. To do so effectively an employer should have a disciplinary code and procedure in place.subject to the LRA, some rules are so common that all employees are expected to be aware of them. It can only harm an employer not to have a proper disciplinary code and procedure in place.

Vanash is spot on.We have our disciplinary code stuck up in the Factory and Warehouse.Whenever we have hearings,the guys on the floor generally know the outcome before the hearing has started.It has taken some time but being fair and consistent has certainly paid off for us.It did mean getting rid of some good people.

[HR Solutions]

Some people that have been too long in a company become stagnant and complacent and do not change with the times. She certainly is out of line, but you need to ask yourself is she good at her job and can you perhaps help her or guide her or train her to your way of thinking. Perhaps the previous owner had a more hard arsed approach, which really doesn't work too well in todays business. I would definitely give her a warning and instruct her to change her attitude - she has got to fit in with your way of running a business and treating people. If she doesn't change or doesn't want to, then you know your answer.

[Entropy Group]

Seems I always have labour related issues...

I have this lady that has been working with the company for about 10 years and with us for about 5 (since we purchased the business) She is a bit of a hard-ass which you need to be in the motor industry, ordering guys around. I've had some complaints of bad attitude before but I attributed it to her no-nonsense approach, and compliments were more forthcoming than complaints. Often it would just be her wording to a customer for example: "Sir, you'll have to wait your turn for wheel alignment" instead of "Sir would you mind waiting a bit for wheel alignment?, I do have a few cars booked before you"

Yesterday things came to a head as I was doing some admin in the office I was called to the floor. I came to the reception counter to find her and a customer in a exchange of word in the realm of "F__k you" and "Jou ma se p__s" I tried to calm the situation, but her and this customer was like fire and petrol. While I was talking to the customer. My sales lady had phoned the police because the customer had threatened to give her "a m__rse klap" At one stage I told her to go into the office, so I can get the customer alone, but in the heat she was out there and back 2 seconds later.

How do I handle this? Do I give her a final written warning for being rude to a customer? Do I charge her at a formal hearing chaired by the RMI for i) Being rude to a customer, and ii) Not being competent for her position, and iii) Insubordination and suggest she either be dismissed or be demoted to admin lady? Do I give her a final written warning and force her to go for training in order to equip her better to handle such situations and communicate better to customers?

My concern here is that a lot of cowboy shoot-from-the-hip advice is rolling out here. Every disciplinary issue needs to be dealt with, yes! Gross misconduct as described is a dismissable offense, yes! You cannot, however, legally "decide" to dismiss someone, or give them a final written warning. Every disciplinary process needs to be substantively and procedurally correct. The elements I agreed to with a"yes" are substantive matters. However, procedural fairness demands a fair participative hearing (ideally with an independent chairperson, for your own protection) where the respondent has an opportunity to state a case, call witnesses, challenge allegations, be represented and have mitigating factors considered. Once an independent chairperson has found the respondent guilty, they would generally recommend an appropriate sanction, and then the decision to act accordingly can be made. Stay calm, control emotions and deal with disciplinary matters professionally, because the law protects you and the respondent alike.

[Entropy Group]

My concern here is that a lot of cowboy shoot-from-the-hip advice is rolling out here. Every disciplinary issue needs to be dealt with, yes! Gross misconduct as described is a dismissable offense, yes! You cannot, however, legally "decide" to dismiss someone, or give them a final written warning. Every disciplinary process needs to be substantively and procedurally correct. The elements I agreed to with a"yes" are substantive matters. However, procedural fairness demands a fair participative hearing (ideally with an independent chairperson, for your own protection) where the respondent has an opportunity to state a case, call witnesses, challenge allegations, be represented and have mitigating factors considered. Once an independent chairperson has found the respondent guilty, they would generally recommend an appropriate sanction, and then the decision to act accordingly can be made. Stay calm, control emotions and deal with disciplinary matters professionally, because the law protects you and the respondent alike.

[cindyreuben]

Hi

Do you have a disciplinary code in place? Are the employees aware of the disciplinary code? I agree absolutely with Entropy Group here - you must be able to prove both procedural and substantive fairness in any disciplinary process. Any knee jerk reaction will probably be the wrong one. If you have an HR department - escalate it to them.

Good luck!