Page 3 of 6 FirstFirst 12345 ... LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 57

Thread: Basic Compliance requirements

  1. #21
    Site Caretaker Dave A's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Durban, South Africa
    Posts
    22,648
    Thanks
    3,304
    Thanked 2,676 Times in 2,257 Posts
    Blog Entries
    12
    Quote Originally Posted by Stef-Lec View Post
    Point of consumption is the terminal of of fixed appliance except if powered from a socket
    That's not what the definition says. Read it again -

    "point of consumption" means any point of outlet or the supply terminals of machinery which is not connected to a point of outlet and which converts electrical energy to another form of energy: Provided that in the case of machinery which has been installed for any specific purpose as a complete unit, the point of consumption shall be the supply terminals which have been provided on the unit of machinery for that purpose;

    In your situation I'd be inclined to say the point of consumption is the supply terminals of the control panel - i.e. your "mini-db" (being the machinery's control panel).

    Of course we all recognise the moment that "mini-db" also supplies something else, like outside lighting, a gazebo, the gate motor, etc. it now becomes a sub-db and the whole game moves to a different level.

    If you don't consider the pool appliance (normally the pump and the pool light) as a complete unit of machinery installed for a specific purpose, then the "control panel" must actually be a sub-db.

    This seems to put me at odds with Andy, which does concern me some. The crux would seem to be what constitutes a "complete unit of machinery", perhaps?
    Last edited by Dave A; 26-Dec-16 at 12:49 PM.

  2. #22
    Diamond Member AndyD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Cape Town
    Posts
    4,923
    Thanks
    576
    Thanked 934 Times in 755 Posts
    Lol, I wouldn't worry about being at odds with me, I'm certainly not an expert and am usually at odds with myself from one day to another. I almost never get involved with this area of electrics (domestic and CoC's) so take anything I say with a pinch of salt.

    point of outlet
    termination of an electrical installation, which has been provided for
    connecting any electrical machinery without the use of a tool, provided
    that no connection to a busbar is deemed to be a point of outlet. (See
    socket-outlet, 3.72)
    The point of outlet for the pool installation was a socket in the bedroom therefore the supply terminal of the machinery is connected to a point of outlet therefor by the definition in 3.55 the supply terminal of the machinery or any point within the pool control box can't be the 'point of consumption'.

    As you say, whether you class a swimming pool a fixed appliance installation along with its light, possibly a chlorinator etc as 'machinery which has been installed for any specific purpose as a complete unit'. The COC itself classes a pool as a fixed appliance but the contention for me with this definition is the 'complete unit' part. It would suggest all components would be have been supplied together as a complete unit and all would be interlinked via common controls. A pool pump and possibly a chlorinator and even a 24hr/7day timer switch could be a 'complete unit' because they're usually interlocked to operate together so an installation consisting of only those items the panel that supplies them could be a control panel. Problem comes with the light with isolating transformer on its own OCPD and own switch which would be an autonomous/extraneous item from the pool machinery although the luminaire itself is an integral part of the pool so would this make the pool box a subDB? Honestly I don't know.

    It would be a similar conundrum with a geyser that has a retrofit energy monitoring gizmo attached to it. Invariably these are supplied from the geyser isolator switch but often they wouldn't pass the 'being installed as a complete unit' requirement so would they be classed as being part of the geyser or would they be a separate fixed appliance meaning the geyser isolator is actually supplying two fixed appliances?
    _______________________________________________

    _______________________________________________

  3. #23
    Email problem
    Join Date
    Nov 2016
    Location
    Umkomaas, KZN
    Posts
    5
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 3 Times in 1 Post
    My thinking is that a pool DB should always be fed directly from a DB, and class it as a SUB DB.
    My reasoning is that on the COC it only lists a POOL PUMP, not POOL DB, so in my mind it should be listed as a separate DB.

    Maybe I dont need to go that far but the SANS 10142 is deemed as a minimum standard so if it is safer or as deemed by me, better, no one can complain.

  4. #24
    Diamond Member AndyD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Cape Town
    Posts
    4,923
    Thanks
    576
    Thanked 934 Times in 755 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Lionels View Post
    .....but the SANS 10142 is deemed as a minimum standard so if it is safer or as deemed by me, better, no one can complain.
    I like the way you think, I agree the code is and should considered be an absolute minimum standard and there's no reason a risk assessment by a competant person shouldn't result in a higher standard being required if necessary.
    _______________________________________________

    _______________________________________________

  5. #25
    Diamond Member Blurock's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Durban
    Posts
    4,151
    Thanks
    758
    Thanked 886 Times in 735 Posts
    Blog Entries
    7
    What is the compliance standard for manufacturing of LED light fittings.
    A friend is manufacturing a really sexy housing from extruded aluminium, but is uncertain about the requirements for the LED lights fitted inside the housing.

    Can someone please help?
    Excellence is not a skill; its an attitude...

  6. #26
    Diamond Member AndyD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Cape Town
    Posts
    4,923
    Thanks
    576
    Thanked 934 Times in 755 Posts
    Maybe contact SABS and ask what the testing/certification requirements would be https://www.sabs.co.za/Sectors-and-S...tronics_pt.asp
    _______________________________________________

    _______________________________________________

  7. Thanks given for this post:

    Blurock (07-Sep-17)

  8. #27
    Full Member markthespark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Cape Town
    Posts
    52
    Thanks
    3
    Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
    Hi guys it seems that most of the topics on the forum are items related to compliance. It would really be helpful if the inspectors of the inspection authorities would join the forum and assist us all with these confusing issues.How do we get them to participate?

  9. #28
    Diamond Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    planet earth
    Posts
    3,943
    Thanks
    153
    Thanked 317 Times in 287 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by markthespark View Post
    Hi guys it seems that most of the topics on the forum are items related to compliance. It would really be helpful if the inspectors of the inspection authorities would join the forum and assist us all with these confusing issues.How do we get them to participate?
    Putting yourself on a public forum and opening up to all these issues would be suicide.

    Getting the correct info about the regs is like trying to squeeze water out of a stone.

    In the perfect world SABS would have a help line. They make the rules they should have people who are employed and trained to offer 24 hours (or at least during office hours) guidance to inspectors.

    The fact that people have to resort to social media platforms like this to get advice is a clear indication of how f&*%&* the system is.

    You can always follow the sparks edition of the regs, they dont even get it right.

  10. #29
    Gold Member Sparks's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Port Elizabeth
    Posts
    890
    Thanks
    20
    Thanked 127 Times in 96 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Blurock View Post
    What is the compliance standard for manufacturing of LED light fittings.
    A friend is manufacturing a really sexy housing from extruded aluminium, but is uncertain about the requirements for the LED lights fitted inside the housing.

    Can someone please help?

    Have him print "Made in China" on it and he will be good to go.

  11. #30
    Diamond Member AndyD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Cape Town
    Posts
    4,923
    Thanks
    576
    Thanked 934 Times in 755 Posts
    I know you guys are talking about interpreting of the regs rather than the regs themselves so on a slight tangent, I've wondered for a while and never got around to asking, does anyone know if the SANS regulations are available to be accessed for free viewing at public libraries? This is the case in the UK, (in theory) you can view all the British Standard regs at any library. In practice they're only available at the main libraries but none the less they're available for public viewing, just wondered if it was the same here.....
    _______________________________________________

    _______________________________________________

Page 3 of 6 FirstFirst 12345 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. [Question] Basic Salary
    By mthokomlita in forum Labour Relations and Legislation Forum
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 27-Jan-15, 11:10 AM
  2. Anyone have some basic Electronics understanding?
    By Dave S in forum General Chat Forum
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 12-Apr-13, 09:43 AM
  3. What are the Electrical Compliance Certificate Requirements
    By MikeS in forum Electrical Contracting Industry Forum
    Replies: 33
    Last Post: 18-Jun-12, 10:24 PM
  4. [Article] Basic Conditions of Employment Act
    By BBBEE_CompSpec in forum Labour Relations and Legislation Forum
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 03-Nov-09, 07:05 PM

Did you like this article? Share it with your favourite social network.

Did you like this article? Share it with your favourite social network.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •