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Thread: Does SEO really work?

  1. #31
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    SEO changed a lot in past few years.. Its not just a game of link building now..but its not dead and it can never die. Each time google provide the updates, SEO take different look. This is like the same when people say that blogging is dead every year.

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    Site Caretaker Dave A's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gavinMA View Post
    Truth is its a struggle to find the right keywords for our Adwords, and we 'waste' a lot of money on jobseekers clicking on our ads, when we really want to be spending the money on finding clients.
    I've found exactly the same challenge in my areas of interest. When it comes to short-tail keywords relating to the trades, the number of searches by would-be students and job seekers far outnumber enquiries from clients looking to spend money to receive the particular service (in most instances by in excess of 20:1).

  3. #33
    Silver Member Greig Whitton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave A View Post
    I've found exactly the same challenge in my areas of interest. When it comes to short-tail keywords relating to the trades, the number of searches by would-be students and job seekers far outnumber enquiries from clients looking to spend money to receive the particular service (in most instances by in excess of 20:1).
    Would you mind posting a sample ad? Some of the bright minds on these forums might pinpoint opportunities for improving the copy and dissuading the wrong audience from clicking on them.

    Founder of Growth Surge - Helping entrepreneurs create more wealth and enjoy more freedom.

  4. #34
    Site Caretaker Dave A's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig Whitton View Post
    Would you mind posting a sample ad? Some of the bright minds on these forums might pinpoint opportunities for improving the copy and dissuading the wrong audience from clicking on them.
    Just changing the ad copy to "dissuade the wrong audience from clicking on them" would be a very bad move as it will lower your CTR. What you need to do first is improve your keyword settings so that your ads only show up in front of the right audience.

    Your ad is actually competing in Google's ad auction based on its CPM, so a lower CTR would require a higher CPC to compensate. A lower CTR is also an indicator that it is less appropriate an ad than one with a higher CTR for the same search phrase, so you'll be pushed down the ad list on that issue too.

  5. #35
    Silver Member Greig Whitton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave A View Post
    Just changing the ad copy to "dissuade the wrong audience from clicking on them" would be a very bad move as it will lower your CTR.
    Done properly, it would only lower your CTR for the people who you aren't trying to attract. Which is a very good thing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave A View Post
    What you need to do first is improve your keyword settings so that your ads only show up in front of the right audience.
    There is no keyword setting for screening out people who have no interest in buying.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave A View Post
    Your ad is actually competing in Google's ad auction based on its CPM, so a lower CTR would require a higher CPC to compensate. A lower CTR is also an indicator that it is less appropriate an ad than one with a higher CTR for the same search phrase, so you'll be pushed down the ad list on that issue too.
    Your Google Quality Score is determined by a number of factors and CTR is just one of them. Even if a lower CTR did raise your CPC, the money that you save by not having the wrong audience click on your ads can still generate a better return on investment.

    Consider the following (simplistic) example: a business consultant sells advisory support to small business owners. His original ad looks something like this:

    Need small business advice?
    Get awesome advice & grow your business!

    100 people click on the ad. 5 of them are owners in stable, established SMEs (his target audience). The other 95 are either startups or people thinking about starting a business who aren't willing to pay for professional help (the wrong audience).

    So he changes his ad to this:

    Need small business advice?
    Get awesome advice from just R999 p/hr & grow your business!

    The price point immediately dissuades the vast majority of the wrong audience (since they have no interest in paying for something) while signalling perceived value to the right audience (i.e. it's much easier to attach perceived value to a market offering when you know how much it will cost).

    Let's assume that the new ads delivers the same 5 clicks from the right audience, while reducing clicks from the wrong audience to 10 instead of 95. Yes, his overall CPM may increase, but he's not paying for all of those wrong clicks. More importantly, he dramatically improves his conversion rate since he's no longer sending hordes of people to his website who aren't the right market for his service.

    Founder of Growth Surge - Helping entrepreneurs create more wealth and enjoy more freedom.

  6. #36
    Email problem workshop's Avatar
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    Is Adsense SEO? Surely not. Would it not make more sense to be advertising on niche speciality web sites that filter out the noise factor?

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    Site Caretaker Dave A's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig Whitton View Post
    Let's assume that the new ads delivers the same 5 clicks from the right audience, while reducing clicks from the wrong audience to 10 instead of 95. Yes, his overall CPM may increase, but he's not paying for all of those wrong clicks.
    But he's still paid more overall to get the 5 people who were real prospects

    Quote Originally Posted by Greig Whitton View Post
    There is no keyword setting for screening out people who have no interest in buying.
    No?
    Here's an obvious example - add "free" to your excluded keywords list.

  8. #38
    Silver Member Greig Whitton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave A View Post
    But he's still paid more overall to get the 5 people who were real prospects
    Even if he doubled his CPC, he would still end up with a substantially better ROI by cutting out the low quality clicks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave A View Post
    Here's an obvious example - add "free" to your excluded keywords list.
    People who aren't interested in paying for goods or services don't always include "free" in their search terms.

    Anyway, my invitation to share some of your actual ad copy so that I (and others) can propose suggestions still stands. Use it, don't it.

    Founder of Growth Surge - Helping entrepreneurs create more wealth and enjoy more freedom.

  9. #39
    Site Caretaker Dave A's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by workshop View Post
    Is Adsense SEO? Surely not.
    There are some linkages.

    AdSense (the publishing of ads) performance is affected by onsite SEO when it comes to Google matching ads appropriate to the content of the page.

    Adwords performance (the placing of ads) can be influenced by the onsite SEO of the landing page.

    Thinking Google SERPS in isolation - Google Analytics will give you stats for organic (i.e. SEO only) and paid (i.e. Adwords) search results.

    Quote Originally Posted by workshop View Post
    Would it not make more sense to be advertising on niche speciality web sites that filter out the noise factor?
    Absolutely. Provided the price is right.

  10. #40
    Site Caretaker Dave A's Avatar
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    Thanks for the offer, Greig. When it comes to my niche markets, my company actually identified and solved the issue years ago. I only mentioned it to endorse Gavin's observation on the subject.

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