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Thread: Geyser not on earth leakage

  1. #11
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    stoves and geyers need not be conected to the earth leakage unt.
    when you conected the live wire to the earth leakage did you conect the neutral to the earth leakage aswell .this would cause it to trip when switched on

  2. #12
    Bronze Member ACEsterhuizen's Avatar
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    I see in the new 2017 regs that geysers now HAVE to be on Earth Leakage.

    6.7.5 Earth leakage protection

    6.7.5.1 Except as allowed in 6.7.5.5 and 7.10.1.6, non-auto-reclosing earth
    leakage protection shall be provided

    a) in a new installation for circuits that supply SANS 164-1 or SANS 164-2
    type socket-outlets,

    b) in an existing installation for all the circuits that supply socket-outlets
    when any such circuit or circuits are rewired or extended.

    NOTE It is recommended that earth leakage protection be installed in all circuits that
    supply socket-outlets in an existing installation.

    c) in circuits supplying water heaters.

  3. #13
    Gold Member Sparks's Avatar
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    In a nutshell, the stove circuit is not required to have earth leakage protection unless the manufacturer request it and nowadays most do. When a stove is connected via socket outlet it obviously must have protection as with all socket outlets( besides dedicated). A stove connected directly through an isolator is not required to have earth leakage protection. The geyser is only required to have protection when, as mentioned, it is in zones 1/2 in the bathroom. The attached photo is of the unit mentioned in 6.16.2.3 which I came across during an inspection. These units must have earth leakage protection purely because of the socket outlet.Click image for larger version. 

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    ACEsterhuizen (13-Dec-17)

  5. #14
    Bronze Member ACEsterhuizen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparks View Post
    .....The geyser is only required to have protection when, as mentioned, it is in zones 1/2 in the bathroom. ....
    Thanks Sparks, please help and point me to the regulation re the above.

    My understanding is that the geyser must be protected, as per the General Safety Principles as in Clause 5: Fundamental Requirements,of sans 10142-2017 2nd edition, for all existing installations, regardless of their installation date, by an earth leakage, and if nuisance tripping occurs, by a separate earth leakage device.


    5.2.3.4 Earth leakage protection shall not be used as an alternative
    protective measure to those given in 5.2.3.2(a) and 5.2.3.2(b).

    Earth leakage protection shall be considered an additional protective measure. (see also
    6.7.5.)


    6.7.5 Earth leakage protection

    6.7.5.1 Except as allowed in 6.7.5.5 and 7.10.1.6, non-auto-reclosing earth
    leakage protection shall be provided:


    a) in a new installation for circuits that supply SANS 164-1 or SANS 164-2
    type socket-outlets,

    b) in an existing installation for all the circuits that supply socket-outlets
    when any such circuit or circuits are rewired or extended.


    NOTE It is recommended that earth leakage protection be installed in all circuits that
    supply socket-outlets in an existing installation.

    c) in circuits supplying water heaters (this does not appear in the previous edition 2009)


    6.7.5.5 The following do not need earth leakage protection:

    a) socket-outlets connected to a safety supply, but see 7.8.3.3 and 7.12;

    b) a socket-outlet that complies with SANS 164-4 and that is intended only
    for the connection of an appliance for critical application (such as
    emergency lighting, a deep-freeze, a burglar alarm, data processing
    equipment
    , or life-supporting equipment);

    c) circuits that supply fixed socket-outlets positioned out of normal reach,
    rated at less than 16 A and intended for the connection of luminaires (see
    6.14.1.4); and

    d) a stove coupler that complies with SANS 60309-1 and of dimensions as
    given in SANS 337 (see 6.15.1.1.5).
    Attached Files Attached Files
    Last edited by ACEsterhuizen; 13-Dec-17 at 10:01 AM.

  6. #15
    Gold Member Sparks's Avatar
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    Thanks for that, I have not picked that change up yet.

  7. #16
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    Fascinating thread. I have a solar geyser and it's up on the roof of our garden flat (it's a 300l that serves the whole house and garden flat). It is currently wired through the Earth Leakage Unit (ELU), and with my intermittent Earth tripping, I have been advised that it can be removed from the ELU. I have seen what some people have said about the Zones, and it is nowhere close to bathrooms. I see that ACEsterhuizen says it should be on the ELU according to the 10142-2017. I have another ELU that was used for a Hot Water Unit that has been removed. I had other plans for the spare ELU, but if the geyser must be on an ELU, then I think that will have to do. I assume that later, when I reinstall the other Hot Water Unit, it can go on that same ELU as the geyser.

  8. #17
    Gold Member Sparks's Avatar
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    As quoted by Acesterhuizen(SANS 10142-2) all geysers must have earth leakage protection now, irrespective of when they were installed.

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    ConcernedHomeowner (25-May-18)

  10. #18
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    Hi

    The regulations state that any fixed appliance must have an isolator within 1.5m or an isolator in the DB that is lockable.

    The trend I see is to put a isolator in the DB for the geyser. In my opinion this is not lockable I know you can get a device to put on the isolator to lock it but not practical as I don't know of any r that does this.

    More practical is too have the isolator in the ceiling next to the geyser.

    Thoughts?

  11. #19
    Site Caretaker Dave A's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SeanM View Post
    In my opinion this is not lockable I know you can get a device to put on the isolator to lock it but not practical...
    Where in the code does it say lockable and practical?

    With most of the locking devices being cheap as chips, surely it's not an expense problem to keep some in your toolbox.
    The trouble with opportunity is it normally comes dressed up as work.

    Alcocks Electrical Services | Alcocks Pest Control & Entomological Services

  12. #20
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    Hi Dave

    Thank you for your comments, so then all circuit breakers are lockable?

    Then the SANS should of just said an isolator within 1.5m or an isolator in the DB not a lockable isolator.

    When I do an installation I plan for when I am not there so therefore prefer to have an isolator within arms reach.

    Maybe I over think things to much, nice to have a forum such as this to discuss these points.

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