Metals Industry strike - my take

[adlomo]

I own a small business, with very few employees, I take care of my employees because they are the people who make money for me , without them I can't do anything. This is the reality that each and every employer should have, the employees don't care how much you know until they know how much you care. The living conditions of the miners in the platinum belt is a reflection of employees who are not cared for by their employers. I will be ashamed if my employees are living in shark's, because that is a demonstration of how they have been paid over a period of time. Which means their conditions has not been improving instead it has been deteriorating. The thing is when you hit the bottom there is nothing else you can lose because you have lost everything over the years, the only thing that can happen is that you must go up , therefore in this case the miners negotiate from the position of strength, that is why they are able to go on for months without a salary but they still survive. Have you ever asked yourself as to how do they survive for so many months without a salary? Can you and I survive a single month without an income? The so called investors over the years have been getting good returns on their investments, the big question is to what extent have they taken into account the plight of the workers I mean genuinely. It is a know fact that the rich are becoming richer and the poor are becoming poorer ,It is also common knowledge that nature does not allow imbalance,so if we think that this condition was to stay like this forever we will be fooling ourselves.Therefore when it happens let us not be quick to blame strikes, because they didn't just occur out of the blue, there were factors that led to it , and those factors could have been avoided,but very little was done about them. One more thing that has blinded the eyes of the investors in our country is greed, this greed has made them not to see the injustice that they were doing to their workers. Unfortunately the workers are starting to be intelligent, they are able to detect if the company can afford a certain level of increases and they stick to their demands. If I was the employer I wouldn't hesitate to ensure that the workers are taken care of by providing decent housing, bundled with other benefits like providing bursaries for the miners children, I am sure if things like these were in place it would have been very difficult for the miners to go strike

[desA]

The point at which apartheid no longer becomes the excuse for present circumstances, is the point from which true growth can occur.

The people of the country need to take ownership of the present situation & determine to make substantive changes.

[Newretailer]

I am going to put my neck out there and give my opinion because Dave asked us to. I agree that the EFF is probably behind the current strikes. What I think though, is that the ground is fertile for them as the workers are angry. I want to differentiate between small and larger businesses. I get that small businesses are not guilty of this as we tend to struggle to keep our head above the water.

If you look at the bigger picture, there is something so immoral about the current situation that something needs to be done. I am talking about directors of larger companies that award themselves obscene amounts of money. Doesn't the CEO of Lonman get something like 17 million annually? IMHO, no human being on earth is worth that much. He didn't start Lonman. He didn't do without to grow the company. He didn't work day in and day out for very long hours without a holiday to make sure the fledgling company grew. No, he went to varsity, did a good job in the work place and eventually landed up there. He deserves a lot more money than the lowest workers, but not that much more. I am using him as example. The same goes for almost every single listed company and government departments.

These obscene salaries need to stop. If I was government I would put a law in place that the highest paid person could not earn more than say 20 times more than the lowest earning person, private and government. I doubt that anyone of us are not already falling within that. I listened to another caller suggesting something like this on the John Robbie show. You know what his reply was? He knew many of these people and we cannot do that as there is competition amongst them as to who earn the most and it is a status symbol for them. If I was a lowly paid worker and I heard that, my blood would be boiling. Heck, I am not and my blood was boiling. We are having people living close to starvation on the one hand and on the other hand we have people with more money than they could ever, ever need.

They shouldn't only see if the mines can survive by paying their workers more. They should add to the equation what would happen if they paid top management less at the same time. A lot less.

We are all paying the price for what these greedy animals are doing. Whilst the top people decide their own salaries, it will not change without laws to control it. This greed has only manifested itself to this degree in the last 30 years or so. The gap didn't use to be so wide. Workers see how much the top people of listed companies are earning and they think it is the same for all companies, even small ones. So they go on strike because they cannot survive and smaller businesses are caught up in the crossfire.

I think it is time that we stop seeing workers as commodities to be milked for their labour because of large unemployment and start seeing them as human beings with rights that also need to live. I think it is time that the people at the top stop thinking they are godly and start realising they are not worth as much as they think they are.

As far as trade unions go, they are so out of hand and short sighted it is unbelievable. The ones at the top of the trade unions are as guilty of lining their pockets while people suffer as are the CEOs. It is clear that they care about money and power and nothing else. In the mean time the workers and small business are the ones suffering.

[Newretailer]

Also, if some kind of law was in place to control the gap between richest and poorest in a company, the need for trade unions would fall away.

[IanF]

ALEC HOGG: But it does appear as though there are other motivating factors. In fact, we did have the CEO of SEIFSA in the studio a bit earlier – Kaizer Nyatsumba – and in the discussions, he freely admitted that the economics of this kind of transaction are going to have consequences. Gerhard, getting back to your people and the guys that you employ (and clearly, you have been following very closely). If Andrew Goldstone from Invicta is accurate in that there were mobs of 100 or so heavily armed NUMSA members arriving at un-unionised operations to force the workers to not go to work, what do you think is going to happen tomorrow when your members start locking out those same NUMSA members who want to come back to work?

GERHARD PAPENFUS: Well, I don’t know. What I do know is that you cannot succumb to this. What has happened in this strike…this wasn’t actually negotiations. It was a form of blackmail. That’s what you do. You engage in strike action, intimidation, and violence to such an extent that you force companies to stop operation. If it weren’t for this kind of action, the strike would have failed. There wasn’t sufficient popular support for the strike, so they have to engage in violence and intimidation. The problem is that by succumbing to this, we are setting the tone for future negotiations. NUMSA has seen this. This is the deal. We demand. Go and strike. We negotiate with the big guys. They make the deals and they make the easier deals. I’m not saying that this was an easy deal. This was a hard deal, but that is not our deal. Our deal is even more difficult.

It’s creating a very dim future for this industry and that didn’t happen now. It happened over years. This industry has lost 700,000 jobs in the last 30 years. NUMSA said at the outset of these negotiations, that the industry lost 250,000 jobs in the last five years. Seven hundred over the last 30 years…in terms of employment numbers, we’re back at 1972. We can see where we’re going. In fact, as we said at the negotiations table, if SEIFSA’s top company sends me an email, it says the way this is going – in ten years’ time there will be no metal industry left. He’s one of the guys who’s signing the deal now.

ALEC HOGG: It’s extraordinary. NEASA’s Chief Executive Gerhard Papenfus, putting a lot on the table. If you’ve been watching this program from the outset, we did talk to Wilhelm Hertzog from RECM at the top of the program who was giving us the view that perhaps this is in the interests of the big employers because it shakes out the weak and who are the weak, but the smaller companies.

From biznews.com interview

If true how do you get workers to stand up to the intimidation?

[pmbguy]

Yes, CEOs cost a fortune, but consider competition. If you cap salaries of CEOs and Executives in SA they will simply move abroad where they Will get big salaries. You will lose them immediately. Future talent would also move away, knowing their ambitions can’t fully be realised in SA. SA would be left handicap. Businesses would close, workers would have no jobs.

“Capping” as an ideal only makes sense if the entire world was in on it, but it’s not so we have to consider the reality instead.

[adrianh]

There are two interlinked issues at hand:
1. Salaries
2. Using strikes as a bargaining tool.

Each issue needs to be addressed separately.

[Fanie]

I find it hard to believe that so many are lead around blindfolded completely unaware of the fraud behind the strikes and other events taking place.

Please consider that when the platinum strikes took place for 5 months, the salaries were not paid, production never stopped and the saved salaries now pays for the salary increase up to the next planned strike. I simply foresee all strikes goes along these lines.

The trillions removed from the Boer Volks resources are funding the NWO who commits one war after another in their quest to conquer and rule the world, and it is funded from here. The USA is bankrupt, so where else does the trillions come from to fund them... ? Even China has more US$ than the US. This is the reason why the Afrikaner broederbonder organizations have to see to it that the Boer Volk gets destroyed and ridiculed so that no one would associate with being a Boer, because the Boer Volk must be prevented from restoring the Boer Republics at all cost, so the plundering can continue.

Not a cent plundered from these resources goes into the "South African" economy, apparently the salaries paid to these black slaves is supposed to be enough for the "economy", since it gets spent here.

The media is supposed the blame the "blacks" for the "disaster" they create. Going back in history just one step then you realize that it was the Cape Dutch Afrikaner, who were illegally placed in charge of the Boer Republics and with force supervised the Boer and through their Afrikaner schools and churches tried to teach them to become Afrikaners.

The Afrikaner got the Boer Republics illegally and free from the British, and they ruined it to the point where they again illegally instated themselves under the black government (or so it is supposed to look). The Afrikaner still sit in the control positions while creating the impression that it is the "blacks" causing all the problems. Visiting other black countries there is nothing of these criminal orchestrated fraud going on, you find it only in SA. Behind what you see is the real culprits creating everything sick, from the gun laws to the toll gate fraud to the strikes to the multiple licensing... everything raping so called "human rights" and "freedom" is thought out to present a false impression, and the black government are only pawns.

The strikes are against the "government" who behind the scenes are the NWO and their gentile Afrikaners, while creating the impression that it is the (without identity) blacks attacking the (without identity) whites. All the Afrikaner web sites are trying to stir this up, especially the Suidlanders. The Afrikaner is trying to steal the Boer identity to again lay claim to the Boer Republics, you can now read on their fraud web sites that the Cape Dutch Afrikaner made the Groot Trek, the Afrikaner fought in Blood River and more, and on the other hand tries to deny and ridicule the Boer existence. It is then also not surprising that the broederbonder TLU had Greg Standton of the NWO's UN's "genocide watch" here, when he returned the "genocide on the Boer" were changed to the "genocide on the Afrikaaaner", and blame the ANC of the genocide. Now if we could only get the blacks to sing "kill the Afrikaner" eh.

If you consider the fraud committed in the Afrikaner staged Afrikaner heard Afrikanermag (aka Boeremag) case (to name ony ONE, the fraud was even published openly in the Raport) then you can form an idea who are really behind crime in SA.

I put it to you that if you remove the Afrikaner and their 300~ broederbonder and freemason organizations from the Boer Republics, then almost all crime will disappear overnight. ALL Afrikaner presidents and most of their cabinet were broederbonders/freemasons serving the NWO. The world over, where the jews get into with their gentile puppets (here it is the Afrikaner) there is exactly the same fraud, destruction and plundering going on.

The Boer Volk's Republics were illegally and with force witheld from the Boer Volk since the war ended in 1902.

So don't blame the blacks, they were brought here on purpose to take the blame for the wrongs they get tricked into so the real criminals can hide behind it. No one in his right mind will open his own country and import foreigners by the millions under the so called "human rights" NWO view unless they think there is a pay-off for them. These black all have their own countries, which is not in the Boer Republics.

Wake up.

The Boer Republics must be restored to their rightful owners, the Boer Volk.

[pmbguy]

Fanie, Jy jaag nou net kak an you must be crazy to think like this, never mind the technicalities of your post

[IanF]

Fanie
I suggest you start your own thread with your post so this thread doesn't go off on a tangent.

[Greig Whitton]

Man, there is nothing like online anonymity to bring out the crazy in people ...

[PeterRich]

The countries of Africa have destroyed their economies due to ongoing power stuggles. Why do people think it would be any different here. We need to put our goverment back into hands that work for their people.

[adrianh]

I find it hard to believe that so many are lead around blindfolded completely unaware of the fraud behind the strikes and other events taking place.

Please consider that when the platinum strikes took place for 5 months, the salaries were not paid, production never stopped and the saved salaries now pays for the salary increase up to the next planned strike. I simply foresee all strikes goes along these lines.

The trillions removed from the Boer Volks resources are funding the NWO who commits one war after another in their quest to conquer and rule the world, and it is funded from here. The USA is bankrupt, so where else does the trillions come from to fund them... ? Even China has more US$ than the US. This is the reason why the Afrikaner broederbonder organizations have to see to it that the Boer Volk gets destroyed and ridiculed so that no one would associate with being a Boer, because the Boer Volk must be prevented from restoring the Boer Republics at all cost, so the plundering can continue.

Not a cent plundered from these resources goes into the "South African" economy, apparently the salaries paid to these black slaves is supposed to be enough for the "economy", since it gets spent here.

The media is supposed the blame the "blacks" for the "disaster" they create. Going back in history just one step then you realize that it was the Cape Dutch Afrikaner, who were illegally placed in charge of the Boer Republics and with force supervised the Boer and through their Afrikaner schools and churches tried to teach them to become Afrikaners.

The Afrikaner got the Boer Republics illegally and free from the British, and they ruined it to the point where they again illegally instated themselves under the black government (or so it is supposed to look). The Afrikaner still sit in the control positions while creating the impression that it is the "blacks" causing all the problems. Visiting other black countries there is nothing of these criminal orchestrated fraud going on, you find it only in SA. Behind what you see is the real culprits creating everything sick, from the gun laws to the toll gate fraud to the strikes to the multiple licensing... everything raping so called "human rights" and "freedom" is thought out to present a false impression, and the black government are only pawns.

The strikes are against the "government" who behind the scenes are the NWO and their gentile Afrikaners, while creating the impression that it is the (without identity) blacks attacking the (without identity) whites. All the Afrikaner web sites are trying to stir this up, especially the Suidlanders. The Afrikaner is trying to steal the Boer identity to again lay claim to the Boer Republics, you can now read on their fraud web sites that the Cape Dutch Afrikaner made the Groot Trek, the Afrikaner fought in Blood River and more, and on the other hand tries to deny and ridicule the Boer existence. It is then also not surprising that the broederbonder TLU had Greg Standton of the NWO's UN's "genocide watch" here, when he returned the "genocide on the Boer" were changed to the "genocide on the Afrikaaaner", and blame the ANC of the genocide. Now if we could only get the blacks to sing "kill the Afrikaner" eh.

If you consider the fraud committed in the Afrikaner staged Afrikaner heard Afrikanermag (aka Boeremag) case (to name ony ONE, the fraud was even published openly in the Raport) then you can form an idea who are really behind crime in SA.

I put it to you that if you remove the Afrikaner and their 300~ broederbonder and freemason organizations from the Boer Republics, then almost all crime will disappear overnight. ALL Afrikaner presidents and most of their cabinet were broederbonders/freemasons serving the NWO. The world over, where the jews get into with their gentile puppets (here it is the Afrikaner) there is exactly the same fraud, destruction and plundering going on.

The Boer Volk's Republics were illegally and with force witheld from the Boer Volk since the war ended in 1902.

So don't blame the blacks, they were brought here on purpose to take the blame for the wrongs they get tricked into so the real criminals can hide behind it. No one in his right mind will open his own country and import foreigners by the millions under the so called "human rights" NWO view unless they think there is a pay-off for them. These black all have their own countries, which is not in the Boer Republics.

Wake up.

The Boer Republics must be restored to their rightful owners, the Boer Volk.

Naai maar die oudtjie van die orandja kan mos nou n lekka k@k storie vertel. Djy moet gaan daar by die boek publishers en dan kan djy sommer daai tale gaan spin en a lekka movie deal kry. Hulle soek mos vir die lekka Suid Afrikaanse Sci Fi soos daai lekka movie "distrik naain"

[PeterRich]

Psycho-graphic Model

Introduction
An over simplification but it gives an indication of emotion and intellectual maturity and is very useful in a marketing situation
Overview
This model is not based on race in any way or form, or education, although some cultures will have a greater number in certain sectors
Every living person also possesses all four qualities in varying degrees and is usually dominated by one.

How it works
The model works on the principle: The identity of self or what your self-esteem is based on. One need's to interrogate each sector with the question “What do you identify with consciously or unconsciously?” or the response one would expect from the question “Who am I?”



A brief over view of each sector


Compassionate God Self
“Who am I?”
I am a selfless spiritual being and believe in practicing compassion”

“How do you make decisions?”
Decisions are based on spiritual principles that will spiritually benefit man and mankind. Violence and force are not options that are considered.

How do we communicate with these people?
Simply by listening and aspiring to achieve their wisdom and values and besides they only constitute very small portion of the market sector.

Examples of these people
The Dalai Lama
The Pope
Gandhi

Intellectual
“Who am I”
I am a leader and usually an educated person who responds to logical reasoning and understands that emotions are useless in a boardroom. I usually choose the moments when emotions are safe to reveal. I am very disciplined

“How do you make decisions?”
Decisions are based on facts and figures. I fight injustice and believe in human rights. I intellectually make decisions to the benefit of man and mankind. I will use violence only as a last resort and usually only enough to restore peace.

How do we communicate with these people
Pride ego and status play a role in these peoples lives but you also need those facts and figures.

Examples of these people
World leaders
Leaders in boardrooms all over the world
Scientists
Educationalists
I have always thought Colin Powell was a good example


Emotional
“Who am I?”
I am usually a blue-collar worker, not an educated person and my beliefs are not always based on fact. I am often religious and often have superstitious beliefs. I have many unconscious double standards, which seem reasonable to me. If you offend me in any way I will resort to violence, and it seldom is, but could be fatal. Fanatical beliefs may also lead to extremist violence

“How do you make decisions?”
I intuitively make decisions and don’t need the facts and figures. Things just have to feel right and not a very disciplined person. My emotions rule me and often get me into trouble. People need to listen to what I say and not how I say it.



How do we communicate with these people?
These people respond to every emotion in the book, and are impulsive buyers and primarily consumers. They seldom acquire great wealth. The comfort of a branded product appeals to these people

Examples of these people
Most of us have a fair slice of this quality
In it’s most radical form: I think it’s called Fundamentalism


Physical Body
‘Who am I?
I am physical body. Just look and see all the things I can do. I believe in force and control. I am physically strong often with a strong sex drive and will abuse any power I have, for the benefit of myself. I am constantly unhappy about something, if the reason disappears for my dissatisfaction, I will manufacture another or shift my focus to another. I have no emotional or intellectual maturity. I will commit any injustice, for the benefit of myself. I am capable of unspeakable violence and have little understanding of the damage I have done. If I can get away with it I will do it. I do not respond to logic and reason. I tend to be a wasteful consumer of products, as opposed to a producer and I am often predisposed to littering.
The other three groups are so naïve, they believe I understand co-operation achieves more than conflict. It is safer to give me a gun because with it I can only harm a few people. But with knowledge and the power to use it, I can destroy populations and even nations.

How do you make decisions?
Promote self-interest irrespective of the consequences

How do we communicate with these people
Any emotion applies but they respond very well to power, domination and control. It may be possible to influence them, by demonstrating physical dominance, (this distresses the other three sectors, because they judge others by their own standards and values) or at the very least, convincing posturing is necessary. Loyalty may be possible by demonstrating fairness from a dominant position. A typical sales strategy would be to have pictures of “gifts” visible during the presentation.

Examples of these people
Africa has many examples (Wealthy leaders, and staving populations)
Children

The last two sectors
Human Rights
We often abuse power. We are the greatest of perpetrators and also victims of Human Rights. If we transgress the principles of Human Rights, we are often the first to complain that we are the victims and manipulate the situation.

[Colleen Keal]

Cosatu and Numsa, don't care about the workers. Its a power struggle and unfortunately its the workers that end up losing at the end of the day. Making unreasonable requests for salary increases and forcing the workers not to be at work, will end up with most companies using automation at the end of the day or closing. So the age old saying "cutting of your nose to spite your face" is applicable here.