New earth bonding test

[Dave A]

All too often, when it comes to earthing and bonding, I feel the incorrect terminology is used in SANS 10142 to describe the earthing terminal in question.
ie. 6.11.2 talks about the main earthing terminal in the distribution board. As far as I'm concerned, that's the consumers earthing terminal. The main one is on the pavement in the stubby.

Check out 6.13.2.6 refers to a distribution board earthing terminal and refers to 6.11.5 that calls it, quite correctly, the consumer's earthing terminal.

As I understand it, the main earthing terminal is normally inside the main distribution board, and the consumer's earthing terminal is a connection point that is supposed to be accessible without opening an electrical enclosure.

[Dylboy]

The not opening one is as far as I know the "readily accessible earth terminal"

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk

[Derlyn]

As I understand it, the main earthing terminal is normally inside the main distribution board, and the consumer's earthing terminal is a connection point that is supposed to be accessible without opening an electrical enclosure.

Oh shucks. I had other plans for this last day of the long weekend, but with this post of yours, Dave, I have no option but to spend it in the books.
She's going to be livid and it's all your fault.

Expect a report back later.

[Derlyn]

First report back.

6.11.5 states that the readily accessible earthing terminal shall be bonded to the consumer's earthing terminal.

Now seeing that the whole idea of installing a readily accessible earthing terminal is so that providers of "other" services do not access the distribution board.

6.11.5 therefore seems to indicate that the consumer's earthing terminal is in the DB otherwise they ( other services ) could have just made use of
it, had it not been in the DB. (edited at 15.47.)

More to follow

[Derlyn]

2nd report back.

3.14.4
Conductor that connects the consumer's earth terminal to the exposed conductive parts of an installation for the purpose of earthing such parts and carrying fault currents.

In every house that I have worked on, the above conductors go directly to the earthing terminal in the db, so then this must be the one referred to in 3.14.4.

[GCE]

@ Dylboy
I have never seen a bonding conductor from the geyser and water pipes going directly to the DB.
I have always bonded the water pipes in the attic to the ECC going to the geyser, as I'm sure many other guys do.

.

You do not need to see the earth wire if Note 2 is attained

6.13 Bonding
NOTE 1 The aim of bonding is to bring all the bonded parts to the same electrical
potential.
NOTE 2 No external conductor is required if compliance with the requirements for
continuity can be proved by the test in 8.6.2.

[Derlyn]

You do not need to see the earth wire if Note 2 is attained

6.13 Bonding
NOTE 1 The aim of bonding is to bring all the bonded parts to the same electrical
potential.
NOTE 2 No external conductor is required if compliance with the requirements for
continuity can be proved by the test in 8.6.2.

The bonding conductor needs to be minimum 2,5mm, however the earth continuity conductor need not be.
The size of the earth continuity conductor will depend on the cable used to supply the appliance.

So if a geyser is wired with 1,5mm FTE then the ECC will be less than 1,5mm sq.
Now you bond the hot & cold pipes with 2,5mm and bond to the earthing terminal on geyser with 2,5mm.
The ECC is also connected to same earthing terminal on the geyser.

The bonding conductor is now 2,5mm and the ECC is less than 1,5mm.

Acceptable ?

I'm reading 6.13.2.2 and the above situation ticks the boxes.
I suppose one would first have to define "earth continuity conductor system"

What sayeth the other toppies ?

This was my original question in case you missed it.

If requirements for continuity cannot be proven by the 8.6.2 test, then will the above be acceptable if by doing so provides a positive result ?

[Dylboy]

You do not need to see the earth wire if Note 2 is attained

6.13 Bonding
NOTE 1 The aim of bonding is to bring all the bonded parts to the same electrical
potential.
NOTE 2 No external conductor is required if compliance with the requirements for
continuity can be proved by the test in 8.6.2.

Morning GCE

Is note 2 applied to the Resistance of the earth continuity conductor i.e table 8.1 and then there I see jt states can be proven using the loop test where by then ten table 8.1 is not used

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk

[Dylboy]

@Derlyn morning! Yes your last oisg about the Ecc being 1.5mm and the binding 2.5mm I agree with as then the earthing is covered and the bonding is covered in two separate conductors

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk

[Derlyn]

@Derlyn morning! Yes your last oisg about the Ecc being 1.5mm and the binding 2.5mm I agree with as then the earthing is covered and the bonding is covered in two separate conductors

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk

Morning brother Dylboy.

The only reason I forwarded the above scenario is because I am seeing more and more of it, as small domestic installations are being wired with 1,5 and 1mm FTE wire and don't know if what I'm doing as far as bonding is concerned, is acceptable.

Plugs and geyser on 16A breakers with 1,5mm wire and lights on 10A breakers with 1mm.
Only the stove circuit, if any, is wired with 4mm.

Don't know if the regulations regarding bonding have taken the above into account.

[GCE]

Morning brother Dylboy.

The only reason I forwarded the above scenario is because I am seeing more and more of it, as small domestic installations are being wired with 1,5 and 1mm FTE wire and don't know if what I'm doing as far as bonding is concerned, is acceptable.

Plugs and geyser on 16A breakers with 1,5mm wire and lights on 10A breakers with 1mm.
Only the stove circuit, if any, is wired with 4mm.

Don't know if the regulations regarding bonding have taken the above into account.

I would say that they have not taken the bonding regulation into account depending on the set up.

It the complete installation is plumbed in copper then you could bond anywhere on the system and get the correct readings and maybe get away with 1,5sqmm Twin and earth and have a separate 2,5sqmm conductor to the hot and cold water system closer to the source.

You cannot reduce the earth wire size which is what you would be doing when going 2,5sqmm bonding to 1,5sqmm geyser earth terminal.

If I read the regulations 6.13.2.2 and take the wording of " water pipes are of conducting material " I could read that only if the complete water reticulation system is copper pipe would I need to bond them.
It does not state that the geyser must be bonded ?

The 2m section of copper pipe that plumbers use, is due to there regulation of needing copper for the first 2 m , I don't see it as being the hot and cold water system.

6.13.2.2 Hot and cold water systems
Where the hot water system includes electric components and the water pipes
are of conducting material, hot and cold water systems shall be bonded
together and also be bonded to the earth continuity conductor system.

Then we also need to watch Table 6.28 - If we use a 1,5sqmm earth wire to the geyser on a 16Amp CB ,that we do not exceed the distance of 38m

And then to complete the circle of confusion - 6.16.2 - States that all water heaters shall be bonded according to 6.13 - So now we are not talking water pipes but the geyser itself.

So my final logic tells me that I need to bond the geyser with 2,5sqmm wire and that I may as well run 2,5sqmm as the circuit and get the job to comply.
I need not run another wire from the geyser to the pipes as I will more than likely get the correct reading , have 2,5sqmm and the copper pipe will more than likely only be 2m long.

6.16.2 Water heaters
NOTE Water heaters include geysers, instantaneous water heaters including units for
boiling water, heat pumps, solar systems, induction water heaters and the like (see also
6.16.1). electrode water heaters, steam generators and boilers are not included (refer
to 6.16.7)
6.16.2.1 All water heaters shall be bonded in accordance with 6.13 and a.c.
supply circuits shall be protected by earth leakage protection with IΔn not
exceeding 30 mA.
NOTE To mitigate nuisance earth leakage tripping, an additional earth leakage may
be provided.

[Derlyn]

Thanks GCE

Now we are on the same frquency.

I feel that a reg should be introduced where there is no 2,5mm ecc in the attic that one should be pulled in from the db for bonding purposes.

Now to confirm where on an installation would one find the consumer's earthing terminal ?

[Dave A]

Now to confirm where on an installation would one find the consumer's earthing terminal ?

I concede I was barking up the wrong tree earlier

Your question remains valid though. Taken from edition 2:

3.17
consumer's earth terminal
terminal that is effectively and permanently earthed and to which the earth
continuity conductor of an installation is permanently connected

6.11 Consumer's earth terminal
6.11.1 Each installation shall have a consumer's earth terminal (see 3.17) at
or near the point where the supply cables to the installation enter the building
or structure. All conductive parts that are to be earthed (see 6.12.3) shall be
connected to a main earthing terminal (see 3.28.4), which shall be
connected to the consumer's earth terminal. The consumer's earth terminal
shall be earthed by connecting it to the supply earth terminal (see 3.78) or
the protective conductor (see 3.14.8) and, if installed, the earth electrode.
The effectiveness of the supplier's protective conductor shall be determined
in accordance with 8.6.5.

if that helps...

[Derlyn]

If there are 3 socket outlet circuits, would it be compliant to twist the 3 ECC's together into 1 slot on the earthing terminal ? ( main or consumer ...... the one in the DB. )

[GCE]

Hi Derlyn

I would be concerned by 6.12.1.2 - Not sure what they mean " tampered with " - I thought it use to say that you would not loose continuity if you disconnected the earth in a circuit but on checking back to Ed1.8 it is still the same statement.

6.1.5 allows for 3 conductors and I would think that 6.11.4 only comes into play on supply cables




6.1.5 A maximum of three conductors may be connected to any one terminal
provided that the terminal has the correct rating.
NOTE Each neutral conductor exceeding 4 mm2 cross-sectional area should be
terminated in separate terminals to facilitate disconnection of any one neutral conductor
without disturbing the connection of any other neutral conductor.

6.11.4 Where conductors from more than one supply are connected to the
main earthing terminal, each conductor connected to the main earthing
terminal shall be able to be disconnected individually without having to disturb
any of the other earthing conductors, irrespective of the number of supplies.
All connections shall be disconnectable only by means of a tool, shall be
mechanically sound, and shall ensure the maintenance of electrical continuity

6.12.1.2 Earth continuity conductors shall be so arranged that they cannot be
tampered with.