The Electrical Certificate of Compliance explained

Collapse
This is a sticky topic.
X
X
 
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • W-TDMI
    Full Member
    • May 2013
    • 39

    #76
    Originally posted by Chrisda
    Hi Everyone,
    I hope some of you smart people can help me please?
    We are buying a house where there is a solar installation, but it also uses power from the municipality at the same time. It does not manually switch over as one will do with a generator but rather just takes form the grid automatically when the batteries fall below a certain level. Now we have noticed on the COC supplied that the question "Is alternative power supply installed" is marked as NO. Can you tell me if this is correct?
    Also, there used to be an electrical stove and the switch is still there but they now have a full gas stove. and its not marked as having a fixed appliance circuit for a stove. is this just because there is currently not stove or could it mean that whole circuit has been removed? We would like to replace the stove with one that has an electrical oven, and thus would need the connection for it.
    Any help or guidance will be much appreciated.[ATTACH]6909[/ATTACH]
    Hi Chrisda.
    For now i will not be to worried about the stove and rather have a Registered person check the PSCC values. Hope this guys just made a typo error on that.
    You are 100% correct that if there is alternative power installed it has to be checked by the registered and noticed on the COC in 3 sections individually.
    For the stove. If there is a point provided for a stove it has to be mentioned.
    Hope you get this soon. Specially the PSCC.
    ~INSPECT, TEST, VERIFY, CERTIFY~

    Comment

    • Sparks
      Gold Member

      • Dec 2009
      • 909

      #77
      What about the 30 socket outlets with no ELCB protection?
      With only 2 light circuits and a pump circuit being fed from the main DB, where are the sub-DBs' being fed from?
      An earthing terminal for other services N/A?
      Incorrect declaration of specialised installation?
      Phase rotation omitted?
      I also suspect the main switch does not break the neutral supply?
      Switching devices tested with a megger?
      No attached Solar COC or reference to it?

      The electrician who connects the stove will check to see whether the cable has been disconnected in the DB and left there for future use.

      Comment

      • Chrisda
        New Member
        • Oct 2017
        • 4

        #78
        Thank you for your replies Sparks & W-TDMI.
        We have spoken to someone else as well and have contacted the transferring attorneys with our concerns. Waiting to hear from them.

        Sparks, the property has 3 phase power from the municipality, and some parts run off the municipal power only. Not sure how that works in terms of feeding the DB board/s...?
        As far as I understood the house itself is the only part which mainly run off solar with municipal power as backup.

        Comment

        • Chrisda
          New Member
          • Oct 2017
          • 4

          #79
          Please can I bother you guys again? I need input on the electricians answers to the lawyers query....

          The lawyer has sent the following (which was her deduction from your replies) to the electrician:
          We refer to the above matter and confirm that you have issued an Electrical Compliance certificate on the above mentioned property on 11 September 2017.

          The following irregularities has come to our attention regarding the COC and we hereby request your reply thereto:

          • The solar supply is a specialized part of the installation and must also be certified by a solar installer. Reference to that COC must also be made on this one. If there is alternative power installed it has to be checked by the registered and noticed on the COC in 3 sections individually.
          • What about the 30 socket outlets with no ELCB protection?
          • With only 2 light circuits and a pump circuit being fed from the main DB, where are the sub-DBs' being fed from?
          • An earthing terminal for other services N/A?
          • Incorrect declaration of specialized installation?
          • Phase rotation omitted?
          • Does the main switch break the neutral supply?
          • Switching devices tested with a megger?
          • No attached Solar COC or reference to it?

          Your urgent response would be appreciated.

          AND this is the reply from the electician

          With reference to the report for the above premises, please see below:-

          • Solar installation (panels and connections to panels), is not a specialized part and it was not covered by any compliance certificate before SANS 10142-1 2017, and a certificate was not required. The new regulations that came out in 2017 only apply for installations installed after 2017 (new regulation book SANS 10142-1 2017).

          With the old regulations only change over switch and indicator to the input and output load is applicable.

          • All socket outlets are under earth leakage protection. The main distribution board (first DB from meters is outside by the borehole pump and supplies DB 1 in main building). There is no section on the compliance certificate to mention supply to other distribution boards (but labelled on main distribution board).
          • There is no specialized electrical installation (false declaration).
          • Regarding phase rotation; I will have to see the certificate I issued, please forward to me.
          • Regarding earth terminal; regulations 6.11.5 states: a readily accessible earth terminal may be provided (not a requirement any longer).
          • Regarding breaking of the neutral conductor, on a 3 phase system the switch does not require the breaking of the neutral conductor. Regulation 6.9.2.2 states: in the case of a multiphase circuit the disconnecting device shall disconnect all the phase conductors but does not need to disconnect the neutral conductor.
          • Switching devices can be tested with a megger (installation resistant tester).

          Please note that major repairs were done to the premises, over R30 000, we did spend 4+ days rectifying for compliance, I do not mind meeting with the new owners on the premises to answer any queries and show them around the installation.

          Comment

          • Sparks
            Gold Member

            • Dec 2009
            • 909

            #80
            Good day Chrisda, I have attached your COC with annotations where I see suspect/missing information. As the responsible person for the installation it would be in your best interest to have an independent contractor go to the site and check everything.
            After 4+ days the installation has had major work done and is no longer just subject to to minimum safety requirements.

            All mention of solar supply is omitted from the COC, this is not acceptable.
            According to the COC as indicated sub DB 2 and 3 socket outlets are not on ELCB
            Are all 3 sub DBs' fed from the main DB or are 2 of them Sub Sub DBs'?
            What exactly is fed from the solar panels and how is it connected?
            Regarding the earth terminal, he must make up his mind whether he is using old or new regulations.
            Regarding breaking the neutral conductor, he must read 6.9.2.2 a bit further. It states further that: In the case of a single-phase circuit, the disconnecting deviceshall disconnect live and neutral. In the case of a multi-phase circuit, the disconnecting device shall disconnect all the phase conductors but neednot disconnect the neutral conductor in an installation connected to a supply system in which the neutral conductor is earthed direct (see theTN system in annex M).
            According to the COC the installation is TNCS
            Electrical CoC 2017.pdf

            Comment

            • Chrisda
              New Member
              • Oct 2017
              • 4

              #81
              Thank you Sparks.
              We have found an electrician to help. Have sent him the info as well as the questions raised by you guys here on the forum. Awaiting his reply and will also ask him to accompany us to meet the COC electrician on site.

              Comment

              • Sparks
                Gold Member

                • Dec 2009
                • 909

                #82
                You are welcome. Unfortunately I am too far to look for myself so only have what I see on the COC to raise alarm bells. Your independent electrician will be able to confirm the actual situation for you once on site. I also notice that you were issued a ECA COC. The ECA is not a governing body but rather Electrical Contractors Union. They do however claim to offer support in the case of one of their members not delivering the service demanded by the regulations. Some people sing their praises but some not, depending on the area/electrician I suppose. Should you not be entirely satisfied with what the issuing electrician has to say, you can approach the nearest ECA branch to query his work. My commentary might sound a bit rough, but I believe in earning my keep and delivering the service I am paid for. This is why I give a lifetime guarantee on my workmanship. While I am proud of the work I deliver, I can unfortunately not say that I am proud of my industry. I hope that all matters are resolved to your satisfaction quickly. Buying a house is many years of debt before it becomes an investment and like I said, you as the owner will be held responsible should anyone be electrocuted and your insurance will use it as an excuse not to pay should an electrical fire break out and they find something illegal.

                Comment

                • IMGREG
                  Email problem
                  • Jul 2010
                  • 21

                  #83
                  Wow this site has been growing and growing.
                  I have been THROWN back into about 5 or 6 COC test and repairs per year.
                  My son is doing the house purchase / rebuild and sell thing.
                  I have a qualified electrician who is doing regulations etc and I have let him test with 3 very competent
                  Port Elizabeth electricians just to get some extra help.
                  Sparks, if I may, would you say the best way to get any updated new regulations and changes would be via ECA.
                  Should I just go and re-join ECA.
                  We now have a house owner insisting we earth a carport that has no light or plugs anyplace near it. Not even a pool.
                  Then they claim that you can no longer use the house earth leakage to supply a flatlet via a breaker from the house.
                  The flatlet has a neat db with all correct items and labels, it has no earth leakage, is that still legal or must I install an
                  earthleakage unit in the flat. (I know its a hassle for the house owner if it trips)
                  Any help will be appreciated.
                  Regards

                  Comment

                  • Sparks
                    Gold Member

                    • Dec 2009
                    • 909

                    #84
                    The new regulations are available to purchase online or you can buy it from SABs in Kipling Road. Getting a hardcopy has its disadvantages and getting the CD has its advantages. Once you have it on your PC it is easy to add the updates as they come out. You can also access it with your cellphone on site. Books tend to wear out after a while of being used. It can lead to a claim from a tenant for damages too. ECA is not a governing body, it is an Association. Joining is voluntary. The latest regs: https://store.sabs.co.za/catalog/pro...2-1-ed-2-00-1/

                    If the owner is going to pay, you can earth his carport, but it is not required for the purpose of issuing a COC if there is no power there. If the ELCB in the house strips within its range from the flat then it is acceptable despite being inconvenient. It can lead to a claim from a tenant for damages too.

                    Comment

                    • Tab Khambule
                      New Member
                      • Oct 2017
                      • 3

                      #85
                      Originally posted by Sparks
                      I hope this will help the non-electrical trade people who pop in to try make sense of the COC:

                      Unfortunately, confusion reigns as many people simply do not understand the law, and many more have an opinion on the matter that have no credibility as to the facts. In order to clarify the issues I will attempt to go back to the basics and explain the requirements.

                      Where do you start?

                      When you contract an Electrician ask him for a copy of his Wireman's Licence, and a copy of his DOL Registration Certificate, don’t let him just show some paperwork that in any event will mean nothing to you. When you have these copies phone your national office of the DOL and CHECK that you are dealing with a Registered Electrician. Most important is to check the electrician’s credentials before any work is undertaken on your property.

                      How does someone become a Registered Electrician

                      When the Electrician has passed his (NTC 3), he would then be allowed to do his trade test.

                      If successful the Electrician would then be known as “Qualified”, but he would not be a Licensed Electrician. To become Licensed Electrician, a Qualified Electrician would have had to write and pass an exam on “Electrical Installation Regulations”.

                      When all this is done and the Electrician has served the appropriate time and passed all the examinations and Trade test the Qualified Electrician will be issued with a Licence from the Department of Labour.

                      If the now Qualified and Licensed Electrician wants to work as an Electrical Contractor he must further register with the DOL as a Registered Person. Please note that this registration must be redone every year.

                      As a Registered Person this Electrician can now issue Electrical Certificates of Compliance (CoC). No other person other than a Registered Person is allowed to issue Certificates of Compliance.

                      There are three categories of a Registered Person.

                      A. Electrical Tester, who can work on a Single Phase installation Basically a normal house supplied with 220 Volt electrical supply
                      B. Installation Electrician who can work on a Three Phase installation. Normally buildings and factories supplied with 380 Volt three phase supply
                      C. Master Electrician for Hazardous Locations, basically petrol stations, mines, flammable areas.

                      An Electrical Tester cannot issue a (CoC) for a Three Phase installation. An Installation Electrician can issue a (CoC) for a single phase installation but not a Hazardous Location, and a Master Electrician can issue a (CoC) for any of the above installations.

                      You now know what a Registered Person is. He is not simply someone that has a good idea of what to do, and he is certainly not a “Handyman” that professes to be a “Jack of all Trades”

                      What are “Electrical Installation Regulations?”

                      As stated before, part of the qualification process is that an Electrician must pass the exam on “Electrical Installation Regulations” these regulations are actually the “Bible” relative to how an electrical installation shall be installed.

                      These regulations are the “Code of Practice” for Electrical Installations namely, The South African National Standard SANS 10142 - for The Wiring of Premises.


                      SANS 10142 is concerned with the basic safety of Electrical Installations. To ensure the protection of people, animals and property and the proper functioning of a fixed electrical installation, the aim is to ensure that protection from hazards that can arise from the operation of an electrical installation under both normal and fault conditions.

                      An electrical installation has to provide protection against

                      - Shock Current
                      - Over Current
                      - Fault Current
                      - Over voltage
                      - Under Voltage
                      - Excessive Temperatures
                      - Electric Arcs

                      If any of the above arises, the protection should automatically disconnect the supply or limit currents and voltages to safe values. In the case of under voltage, the protection should ensure that dangerous situations due to the loss and restoration of supply (for example to a motor) or due to a drop in voltage cannot occur.

                      The code only covers the electrical installation and the circuits feeding fixed appliances, but does not cover any appliances, for example stoves, geysers, air conditioning and refrigeration plant.

                      What makes the Electrical Installation Regulations Law

                      The Occupational Health and safety Act, 1993 (Act No. 85 of 1993) (OHS Act), which is administered by the Chief Inspector of Occupational Health and safety of the Department of Labour, requires that electrical installations comply with the requirements of SANS 10142. It also requires that a registered person, as defined (Master installation electrician, installation electrician or electrical tester for single phase), will issue a Certificate of Compliance together with a test report.

                      The certificate shall be in the form of the Certificate of Compliance published in the Electrical Installation regulations, and the test report shall be in the form of the test report published in the Electrical Installation regulations.``


                      What is a Certificate of Compliance

                      The Certificate of Compliance (CoC) is a declaration by the registered person that the electrical installation has been carried out in accordance with the requirements of the Occupational Health and Safety Act, 1993 and the regulations hereunder.

                      It is important to note that if you have a valid (CoC) it must be kept at the premises that the (CoC) relates to .In many cases they end up with Estate Agents, Conveyancing Attorneys or Banks.

                      If the (CoC) is valid and work is done to the system after the (CoC) was issued, a new (CoC) must be issued BUT only for that part of the installation where additional work was done to the electrical system. The additional (CoC) must be filed with the original and kept on hand if and when required by any inspection authority.

                      If any part of an electrical installation does not comply, the registered person cannot issue a (CoC)

                      No alterations are permitted on a (CoC)

                      Only a registered person may issue a (CoC)

                      What is a Test Report

                      The Test Report contains all the specific details of the electrical installation. It is a comprehensive record of exactly what forms part of the installation inclusive of specific tests in relation to readings and test instruments used. The test report should further contain diagrams and if necessary photographic evidence of the installation as tested.

                      The test report must accompany the (CoC)

                      Who must have a Certificate of Compliance

                      According to Regulation 7 (1), of the Occupation Health and Safety Act, 1993, every user or lessor of an electrical installation, as the case may be shall have a valid (CoC) accompanied by a test report, in respect for every such electrical installation.

                      In simple terms every property owner or alternatively person renting a property must have a valid (CoC), furthermore should an inspector of the Department of Labour or supply authority or approved inspection authority request the (CoC) a valid (CoC) must be produced.


                      Selling Property and the role of the Certificate of Compliance

                      The (OHS) Act goes further to state that no machinery (an electrical installation is defined as machinery) may be sold unless it complies with the prescribed safety requirements. The (CoC) is the only accepted and endorsed proof of that compliance.

                      The Occupational Health and Safety Act has always determined under Section 22 that a property cannot be offered for sale unless a valid (CoC) is in place.

                      Section (5) of the new Electrical Installation Regulation (R242) 6 March 2009, further states that the validity of a (CoC) cannot exceed (2) two years, therefore it is the responsibility of the User or Lessor of an electrical installation to ensure that the (CoC) is not older than two years.

                      The (CoC) document has been formulated by the SABS, with stakeholder input, and accepted by the Department of Labour as being indicative of the safety standards to be applied. For this reason, the majority of property sale agreements stipulate that a seller must provide the buyer with a valid certificate of compliance.

                      A seller doing so can be comfortable that the electrical installation is safe and compliant, in turn giving the buyer comfort and assurance that all is well with the electrical installation. It’s to the advantage of the agent as well to know that there will be no delays in processing the offer to purchase and transfer documentation.

                      It is recommended that an inspection of the property be carried out before buying or selling process to ensure there are no surprises later on. A seller may claim that no alterations were done to the electrical installation and that their (CoC) is valid, but the truth is that even minor electrical work such as fitting a ceiling fan, new oven, extractor fan, new light fittings or replacing faulty plugs can render an existing (CoC) null and void.

                      A home buyer or a lessor can now insist on seeing a valid (CoC) upon their viewing a property for sale or rent and before they sign any agreements or Offer to Purchase.

                      Department of Labour should be cracking down on AGENTS and SELLERS who contravene the law.

                      Sectional Title Property and the Certificate of Compliance

                      When a person buys into a sectional title property the buyer needs to additionally establish if a valid (CoC) is also in place for the “common” property, covering, lights, gate motors, pool pumps and any other electrical equipment that forms part of the “common” property.

                      Should the “common” property not have a valid (CoC) the Body Corporate can be held criminally liable should there be any incident related to the electrical system on the “common” property.

                      Rental Property, Lodges Hotels and Caravan & Camping Sites

                      It is a legal requirement that if you are renting any property that encompasses an electrical installation that such an installation must have a valid (CoC).

                      Letting agents are known to “slip in” clauses that make the electrical installation the responsibility of the tenant. Please be aware of this and read your contract carefully.

                      When it comes to Lodges, Hotels, Caravan and Camping Sites the facility concerned must have a valid copy of the (CoC) for each room or site, the tenant or guest is entitled to request a copy of the (CoC) prior to taking occupation of the room or site.
                      Advertising and or marketing of an establishment that is non compliant, will be in breach of Section 22 of the Act.
                      There is a possibility that The Tourism Grading Council as well as AA Recommended Destinations will have to be re accredited taking the requirements of The Occupational Health and Safety Act into account.

                      Requirements relative to Certificate of Compliance and Selling Property

                      Regulations should have a huge implication on the Real estate industry. It should mean that AGENTS seeking mandates from property sellers will have to request an up-to-date (CoC), if they want to stay on the right side of the law.

                      Nobody including agents may market a property that does not have a valid (CoC)

                      Sellers and Buyers would be well advised to use their own registered electrician to supply a (CoC)

                      The Buyer is able to report both the Agent and the Seller to the authorities if the property is being marketed without a certificate.

                      Insurance

                      It must be noted that an insurance claim resultant from a fire or injury caused directly or indirectly by negligence and non compliance to the requirements of the Act, may result in the claim being repudiated.

                      Plumbers

                      It is advisable to have the plumbing also certified, but that is another domain altogether, however it has been common practice for plumbers to interfere with the electrical wiring when replacing geysers, very often the (CoC) is invalidated by their actions.
                      THEY ARE NOT QUALIFIED ELECTRICIANS, IF A PLUMBER REPLACES YOUR GEYSER ASK HIM FOR AN ELECTRICAL CERTIFICATE FOR THE REPLACEMENT OF THE GEYSER


                      TV Aerials and Satellite Dishes

                      Many people do not know that it is a requirement of SANS 10142 that TV Aerials and Satellite Dishes must be earthed.
                      TV Aerials and Satellite Dishes, do form part of the electrical test and should they not be earthed a certificate of compliance cannot be issued.

                      Replacement of Lights Fittings and Socket Outlets

                      Please remember that when replacing any part of your electrical installation you must ensure that such replacement items comply with the relevant SANS codes, many spares that are available from the large hardware wholesalers are cheap imports that do not comply to South African Standards, light fittings are particularly suspect when it comes to compliance. Ask your supplier for proof that the item complies with South African standards.

                      I trust the COC is somewhat less of a mystery now to buyers and sellers alike.
                      Hi Sparks,
                      I am so happy to get a clear information like this. For our learners here at the Training Centre, they will benefit a lot and we will use this information to answer most of the questions learners ask.
                      Joining this group will equip me with valuable information.
                      Thanks again to you and everyone participating in this forum.
                      Tab

                      Comment

                      • Dave A
                        Site Caretaker

                        • May 2006
                        • 22810

                        #86
                        Originally posted by Sparks
                        TV Aerials and Satellite Dishes

                        Many people do not know that it is a requirement of SANS 10142 that TV Aerials and Satellite Dishes must be earthed.
                        TV Aerials and Satellite Dishes, do form part of the electrical test and should they not be earthed a certificate of compliance cannot be issued.
                        Just to point out that as of Edition 2.0, "must" has become "may".
                        Participation is voluntary.

                        Alcocks Electrical Services | Alcocks Pest Control & Entomological Services | Alcocks Hygiene Services

                        Comment

                        • Sparks
                          Gold Member

                          • Dec 2009
                          • 909

                          #87
                          Quite correct Dave, which begs the question, when inspecting an old installation, do new or old regs apply?

                          Comment

                          • Sparks
                            Gold Member

                            • Dec 2009
                            • 909

                            #88
                            I am happy that you find this informative Tab. Being at a training center I will take this opportunity to bring to you attention: "a qualified electrician may not work without the direct supervision of an accredited electrician". This means that under no circumstances may a student do electrical work in his spare time. There is simply too much he does not know and he is putting people's lives and property at risk.

                            Comment

                            • Dave A
                              Site Caretaker

                              • May 2006
                              • 22810

                              #89
                              Originally posted by Sparks
                              Quite correct Dave, which begs the question, when inspecting an old installation, do new or old regs apply?
                              I was in a discussion the other other day on just this thing. The argument was that as the satellite dish was installed two years ago, currently does not have an earth but required one at the time of installation, it has to be earthed before a 9.2.(b) CoC may be issued now even though the the current standard does not demand it any longer!

                              This is insanity.

                              To my mind this also plainly demonstrates just how ridiculous the thinking is of "if the electrical installation was compliant at the time of the installation and no changes have been made, it remains compliant today". It's a line of thinking that belongs to the dinosaurs.

                              Technology, and our understanding of it develops and improves over time. It is entirely reasonable that what we determine as "the bare minimum' must adjust accordingly over time too.
                              Participation is voluntary.

                              Alcocks Electrical Services | Alcocks Pest Control & Entomological Services | Alcocks Hygiene Services

                              Comment

                              • AndyD
                                Diamond Member

                                • Jan 2010
                                • 4946

                                #90
                                Originally posted by Dave A
                                I was in a discussion the other other day on just this thing. The argument was that as the satellite dish was installed two years ago, currently does not have an earth but required one at the time of installation, it has to be earthed before a 9.2.(b) CoC may be issued now even though the the current standard does not demand it any longer!.........
                                This would turn into a time consuming game, trying to put an installation date to items such as geysers, satellite dishes and DB's to figure out which historic earthing standards (or surge protection standards in the case of the DB's) they should be tested to. The only way to do this with any certainty would be to refuse to inspect and test any item the customer can't provide an original invoice for.

                                When amendments are issued to the regs the instructions say the superceeded pages should be removed. This would effectively mean you'd need to have every previous amendment and every previous version of the regs separately available for reference during a CoC.
                                _______________________________________________

                                _______________________________________________

                                Comment

                                Working...