Give For Life

[Hane]

Yes, people need to recruit members to make profit, but at some stage there will be no more people to recruit. Furthermore the percentage of people that will recruit 10 persons becomes less and less as their are more members recruited. As this happens so people will quit exasperating the issue.
In light of the fact that 10 people are hurt for every 1 happy person, that is poor. The top person(association) gains at these peoples expense. We call this unjust enrichment.

People wont be "used up" or else no network marketing venture is worth it.

The top person(association) is the Giving Organisation that runs different fund raising projects to raise funds for charities. So even if the association is gaining more money that means that the charities will be earning more.

So, the question is - do you deny that people will be harmed and lose money because of this?

Not everyone that ventures into network marketing will make a success of it no matter what they sell.

[Dave A]

The Giving Organisation is getting the money that is collected to pay bills, staff and to fund other projects to raise funds for charities.

So this is a registered not-for-profit charity organisation with a constitution to that effect?

[desA]

Sounds a lot like the Madoff feeder-funds concept into his ponzi scheme.

The only difference is that there is a small exit flow to charities. Hold-on - Madoff also gave generously to charities. Made-off with a lot of people's money, he did...

[Hane]

The Giving Organisation is an independent Trust, owned and managed by its beneficiaries, audited by PricewaterhouseCoopers and is honoured to have Archbishop Desmond Tutu as its Patron. The Giving Organisation is about good cause organisations working together. It’s about companies, suppliers and customers uniting to make an ongoing difference! This organisation has the exclusive aim of uniting charities in South Africa and developing innovative
ways of creating a sustainable source of income for them. All funds raised are paid directly into The Giving Organisation Trust Account and distributed based on simplistic models to be agreed with each employer.

Taken from The Giving Organisations Website

[Hane]

For people making less than their contribution they need to recruit more people. these people in turn are making less than they contribute.
Using the single chain concept, as per earlier posts, a person needs 2 chains to break even.
Each chain needs 5 members, all of which are contributing more than they earn in commision. As 2 chains are required that means for 1 person breaking even there are 10 earning less than they contribute or running at a loss.

This isn't quite true. I haven't been actively marketing so have only one Agent beneath me but he on the other hand has been aggressively marketing GiveForLife and he is already breaking even and I'm not even close. YOu dont need 10 people to break even, you only need 3 if you take the silver or bronze package.

[Dave A]

And so a whole new pile of issues emerge.

First we have the issue of websites.

Following the Giving Organisation trail, there is a Give for life website here, which one assumes is the official one belonging to the organisation. What we've had so far from Hane is a series of links to another website, a "give for life" subdomain of hefty. Hefty seems to be all about used agricultural and earthmoving equipment.

OK. I'm but I'm sure Hane will explain.

Next, reading the Give for Life website (the official one), we find a legal documents page and discover that Gife for Life is an independant trust administered by BOE Trust. So far so good. But then it gets interesting.

First, the beneficiaries per the trust deed are not mentioned. This information would go a long way to assuring that the profits (which up to now would seem to have the potential to exceed the moneys that actually goes to charities per the marketing spin) are indeed going to a worthy cause and is not going to end up lining someone's pocket.

Second, there is the issue of whether this is a pyramid scheme or a lawful network marketing operation. And I suggest what has been presented to assure us is little more than spin.

Much is made of the "endorsement" of the Law Review Project. Based on the published correspondence, the Law Review Project has advised this trust and has issued a carefully worded letter, but they don't give a flat-out endorsement that this is a legal network marketing scheme. What they point out is they have advised the Department of Trade and Industry (among others) as to the details of the scheme, and point out that it is the DTI that normally makes this sort of determination. A published response by the DTI one way or the other is notable by its absence.

And all said, I'm not surprised at the lack of clear legal endorsement - by my understanding this is a legal quagmire at the very least.

But I have to do some work that pays the bills now...

Be back later.

[Hane]

Hefty.co.za is my main business I'm in used agricultural equipment.

I made a sub domain for myself because its easier than to send people directly to the official Give For Life site. I can track it and see if I do get a response. I give one to each of the people that sign up in my down line as well and I added a blogging feature where everyone that joins can tell about their experience.

[Dave A]

Thanks Hane.

One of the key ingredients that seperates network marketing/MLM offerings from pyramid schemes is the flow of product. If there is no flow of product, it's a pyramid - period. So the first thing we need to look for here is a product.

No problem, you might say - charity is the product, or more specifically that warm, fuzzy feeling of having made a contribution to help those less fortunate than ourselves.

Well, charity is an interesting "product" at the best of times if we're looking at the "consumer" receiving something for the money he/she has stumped up. I'm quite sure impressive arguments could be raised both for and against charity being a product, but let's for a moment accept that warm, fuzzy feeling as a product.

From here you start chasing your tail a bit because defining a charity is messy.
SARS has its ideas.
SA Government Services has its ideas.
And when it comes to costs of fundraising, the Southern African Institute of Fundraising has its ideas too.

Or can we cut through the charity entanglement by pointing out that a network marketing operation is, by its very nature, a business operation? Which in turn would imply that charity as purpose and network marketing as method appears to be mutually exclusive.

Probably going to take someone smarter than me to answer that with any clarity - but no matter how you bob and weave, you're still going to come back to the fact that only 20% is guaranteed to reach the charities. Which has to leave you wondering about the primary purpose.

[wmarais]

Give for Life small business opportunity

Hi,

I am sure a lot of you have seen the Give for Life program, if not, listen here.

The Give for Life program gives each South African the unique opportunity to start their own business. What makes the Give for Life program so unique is that you will actually be contributing to our South African charities while you earn cash for your eforts. The program is already supported by some of our biggest companies and most famous celebs.

How does it work? You join the program and agree to donate R189 per month to the charity of your choice, you will then be able to refer other people to do the same (join the program as one of your downline). For each person you refer, you will earn a monthly commission on. There are 5 levels of commissions. some people are already earning over R30 000 per month on commissions. You can find out more here: www.giveforlife.net

If you join the program through my site (thus you will be one of my downline) I will do the following for you:

- Provide you with your own website (it will have your details on it so that you can generate members (downline)).
- Your own domain name (will not be a subdomain), toplevel domain name. You decide what you want and I'll get it for you.
- Fee advertising on 7 of my other sites (these include www.rocketsa.com and www.samoneysystem.com)
- Admin access to the give for life blog (post as many articles about your program as you wish)


contact me if you need more info,

Thanks
William

[IanF]

Hi,

I am sure a lot of you have seen the Give for Life program, if not, listen here.
......
contact me if you need more info,

Thanks
William

Hi William,
Welcome before trying to hook us into your businesses you should tell us a bit about you. Then more interest may be shown. JAT

[desA]

Are we going to be Shigley'd?

[wmarais]

Hi IanF,

Thanks for the welcome message. I am William Marais, currently living in Canada for almost 2 years now, work in the oil and gas industry as a chemical engineer.

I am the author of the SA Money System and webmaster of 7-8 other sites.

I am not trying to spam this forum or anything. I truly feel the Give for Life program has good behind it. I know a lot f people are scheptical and that's fine, we all are at the beginning

desA, I like helping people succeed online, one thing a learned with online businesses is that one can't make it alone. I provide each of my members with all the stuff I said (website etc).

Thanks
William

[Skulk]

Any way one looks at this nonsense, it is a pyramid scheme. Sure, the developers have succeeded in finding a loophole in the laws. The charity organisations (and the famous sponsors) will gladly accept any amount given to the charity, even if it is just 1% of the scheme turnover. After all, charity needs money and any cash is wellcome.

So, the supporters of this latest pyramid scheme have found a cunning way to profit from scheming for charity, I'd say.

Pity, it does in some way tarnish the whole charity principle.

[SilverNodashi]

Skulk, I agree with you. This is a pyramid scheme, doesn't matter how colorful you make it.

@Hane, don't you think the money for charity should rather go to the charities, than the brokers? No offence, but it sounds to me like the "give money to a charity" part is just another disguise for people to get rich from other people's efforts? I would rather give my full R1000 (or even R100,000 for that matter, imagine how much you just lost!) directly to the charity, than to fund your wealth and scam.

[Hane]

Hi guys sorry I haven't replied before was waiting for Give For Life to make all there changes before I ask your opinion again.

Lets start over and I tell you about the new Give For Life and you tell me what you think about it now.

They changed their pricing structure and you only have one product to buy. Its R289 per month then you get:

1. Visa Cash Back Card

The Visa Cash back card gives you the convenience of an additional bank account at no fixed monthly costs, a prestigious Visa pre-paid credit card, and the ability to earn cash back benefits credited directly to your account on all purchases at any Visa accredited merchant as well as our Recommended Retailers and selected ATM’s. Please note that you don't need to change your current bank account and can simply transfer funds into this card account or upload funds at any Easy Pay counter and start enjoying the benefits.

2. Family Benefits Plan

Receive the benefits of the Amadwala Family Life cover and Accident plan, providing life cover to you, your spouse and up to 5 children. Additional benefits include free burial repatriation from anywhere in South Africa, HIV trauma and assault cover, health assistance, educational assistance, legal assistance and and much more. Remember, it comes all inclusive as part of your Give For Life subscription at no additional costs.

3. Financial Planning Software

The Business Optimizer software helps you to do personal planning and prepare financial statements without hiring an expensive accountant. This is an excellent tool for financial planning for personal, household and business purposes. And yes, the personal cash flow plan is included in your monthly Give For Life subscription at no additional cost.

4. Buy prepaid airtime conveniently from your phone and get cash back

You can now purchase your prepaid airtime conveniently from your phone for yourself or others from any of the cell phone networks. We even give you cash back on your purchases.

5. Extra Income

Give For Life also offers an attractive business opportunity by paying high commissions to members who successfully secure other subscribers to the program. This simply means you can earn extra income similar to that of an Estate Agent while supporting charity in a big way and receiving great benefits. Consider this - when you get only 4 other people to subscribe, you earn income greater than your own subscription. This means you get all the monthly Give For Life benefits absolutely free and can continue earning additional income every month thereafter.

6. Give to Charity

What makes Give For Life a remarkable product is that it supports charity while providing its subscribers great benefits at the same time. Every month, we donate a fixed monthly amount of R45 on your behalf to charity and by combining the small monthly donations of all our subscribers, charities benefit significantly. Imagine, by simply using a great product, you are also supporting charity!

Their commission structure changed here is the new structure.
Level 1 R73.50
Level 2 R13
Level 3 R6.50
Level 4 R6.50
Level 4 R6.50

You can take a look at everything on their website www.giveforlife.co.za

Let me know what you think.

Hanè