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Thread: The job hopping professionals.

  1. #1
    Site Caretaker Dave A's Avatar
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    The job hopping professionals.

    I've come across various aspects of the job hopping phenomenon lately, and some aspects are making the news.

    Here's an article coming out in defence of the job hopping black professionals (and taking a bit of a dig at Tito Mboweni and Trevor Manuel).
    In an economy in which they contribute too little, how can black professionals, by insinuation or otherwise, be seen as drivers of inflation when they are looking for better opportunities?

    Even if job-hopping was a contributing factor, is it not inevitable that when people have been oppressed and denied opportunities for too long, once those opportunities are opened, they would seek to enjoy the fruits of freedom from job limitations: high salary perks and the like?

    As for the Afrikaner bank assistants, it is politically naïve for Mboweni to seek to applaud them by juxtaposing them with black professionals, especially in an industry which is pre-dominantly white at the middle and the top.

    You cannot condemn black people from wanting to fill in those places at the top - when in fact employment equity legislation (partly Mboweni's brainchild when he was labour minister) requires it.

    In fact his latter-day successor, Membathisi Mdladlana, is at war with big companies for lack of compliance.
    full story on Fin24 here
    I went to a bank presentation about a month ago and they were describing the modern generation as the "Now" generation. Essentially, this involved instant gratification; do today, earn today, spend today, and who cares about tomorrow. The point the presenter made was that if you are looking for loyalty, get a dog. Your key staff will leave with the next better job offer - period. Forget about medium term prospects - it's about what is in the pay packet today.

    I tend to disagree, but then I'm from an earlier generation. But the issue raises some interesting questions, methinks.

    Is this new generation really so short term reward oriented and transient?
    Is it true that staying too long with a company is bad for your CV?
    How much of this is due to bad HR?
    How much of this is due to skewed company priorities when it comes to employing?
    Seeing opportunity changes nothing. Seizing opportunity and running with it changes lives.

  2. #2
    just me duncan drennan's Avatar
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    It is an interesting question and I have to do some soul searching to answer that because I would tend to be someone who would be prone to moving jobs regularly if I was an employee (but I consider "regularly" 3-5 yrs). Also moving jobs would not necessarily imply moving companies.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave A View Post
    Your key staff will leave with the next better job offer - period. Forget about medium term prospects - it's about what is in the pay packet today.
    It seems like that is a very one sided approach - it's all about the money. Before leaving full time employ one of the things that I had to evaluate was what I was getting out compared to what I was putting in. Obviously cash is a reality, but so are opportunities for personal growth and learning. Even things such as recognition can play a role (a lot of the things mentioned in the "Motivating your staff" thread come to mind).

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave A View Post
    Is this new generation really so short term reward oriented and transient?
    Is it true that staying too long with a company is bad for your CV?
    How much of this is due to bad HR?
    How much of this is due to skewed company priorities when it comes to employing?
    I think there are a couple of things to think about. There has definitely been a compression of time frames (for lack of a better term) due to advancing communications and technologies. It seems to have impacted just about every area of our lives in some ways. I think that in general this tends to stimulate short term reward thinking rather than momentum building.

    I think that in general you would get two types of "job hoppers" - those that do it purely for short term reward (i.e. higher pay) and those that would do it as part of building a solid foundation for what they want to achieve. The latter would tend to see the pay reward as secondary to the learning experience (in my opinion).

    Another thing is the question of how secure a job really is. A job is not really a guarantee of security, so in what way does that motivate someone to choose the highest short term gain as a form of "future insurance" (in practice though it would seem most people take short term gain to increase lifestyle).

    In terms of HR and skewed company policies my only experience is on the receiving side as an employee. Being very successful at what you do can end up with you being the desirable employee to do that - i.e. stuck in one job with little prospect for growth. I think one has to try take a long term view and see what is most beneficial, keeping a person for a short term in their current position, or keeping the person for the longest term with the company? That's very dependant on the individual case.

  3. #3
    Platinum Member Marq's Avatar
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    My answers to your questions, Dave would be, Yes Yes 100% & 100%.

    I also grew up in the old school where my parents taught me that Companies would only look to stable candidates and that stable meant that you had stayed in one company, done the time and gone the distance up the promotional ladder the "right way" - whatever that meant.

    After many years in a few companies, having worked my way to the top, I was head hunted and thought "finally I've arrived". At the final interview, I was told that I did not have enough experience and that they would be taking the other candidate. "Not enough experience????!!!! - "What do mean I have 10 year on the other candidate and held far higher positions and love my job - what more do you need?" "Ah" they said; "you havnt been in enough companies and seen all the aspects of the different industries......"

    Well thats when I learn the fast and hard way, that I had just wasted all my years and my parents were wrong and rich guy poor guy was not a fairy tale book.

    I researched, asked around, talked to my staff, discussed the job reviews and all those HR things that they do to try and justify their functions and found that the answers to the questions being asked here were indeed - Money talks BS walks - job satisfaction = 0% Money = 100%.
    Through my own experience and talks - many jobs = good CV Experience
    Bad HR - all HR appears to be bad - I find them wanting in many areas and the main areas are that they themselves are the wrong people in the job trying to award themselves big pay packets first and then we can look to the rest. (generally speaking of course)
    Skewed company priorities - get the job done at all costs (usually the cheapest) and the attitude that if you want loyalty - get a dog.

    I also saw this many years ago (well about 10-15) when business consultants were all the rage. They started talking about a resource - "go and get another resource" - when I enquired what they were talking about I discovered that this was how they refered to their staff. So already in the eighties there were no "real people" around. There were only resourse - easily expendable, just pay them the going rate and then let them move on.

    The current generation will always be the "now generation" - these are just terms used to look fancy by presenters. I always cut through that BS and look at their underlying philosophies - usually there is not much substance to them and I find that the older guys still have the edge. In all of the above thoughts and the processes of quick starts, streamlining, fast tracking etc one thing is allways left out - The basics.

    Without the basics in place, the end result of these quick thinking fast food take away skilled programmes and related courses are a disappointed employee level that cannot be top achievers and they will always have something missing that they just cannot get a handle on.

    Job satisfaction will never be on the menu because the job changes so much and the understanding of the job at the top level will only be the playground of the few. As a result the only other option is survival mode and this equates to money satisfaction. I wonder if this is not also a reason for the readiness of many to grab the corruption angle as well.

    HR does not see this - just pump more motivational courses at the staff - and for the rest well there are many out there looking, we dont have to worry about long term staff any more.
    Psychologists and the like, supposedly helping the hr industry, are run by people who need the treatment more than their patients - so they wont see it.
    Management is in survival mode as a result of the staff coming through the ranks without the basics in place - so they dont see it.
    While business continues to pay out mega million gold watch payoffs to those who do not appear to have earned it, they continue to send the message through that the key motivator is money and one does not have to work for it.

    The dollar is king in the states and the majority bowing to it do not even know the basics of the economy and where it comes from. They are responsible for specialisation in the business world. I grew up in business world were we had to masters all aspects and learn many basics. Today the kids are learning to specialise from the start.

    Talking of dollars and time reminds me of a joke about some religious man who was particularly angry with God. He reasoned that since a thousand years in the Eyes of the Eternal One would be like one minute, then a thousand Dollars must be to God like one Dollar. Confidently he asked: "Master of the Universe, can I have one of Your Dollars?" God answered: "Just wait a minute."

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