Who's in Charge?

**Sparks** · 19-Dec-13, 06:29 AM

Originally Posted by ELECT 1

i doubt that they have the teeth to fight anything disappear.

Sez who?

https://www.dropbox.com/s/vzzkfg71r99nn49/DOL%20SA.jpg

**ians** · 19-Dec-13, 07:39 AM

This is one of the reasons...you can do a 8 hours course on gate automation and become a qualified technician in 1 day, which entitles the company to charge more per hours for their "technicians" than an electrical company can charge for a master electrician, or better still a camera installer, you don't even need any qualifications and you can right a hole in the customers backside so big that he will have to use his entire Christmas bonus to install 4 cameras, which by the way only cost a couple hundred rand not thousands of rand (not talking about IP cameras) and the cable is just as cheap. The "technician" is normally just some person who has a little more experience than yourself, believe me you don't need to be a brain surgeon or even an electrician for that matter to install cameras, so you have to ask yourself why do they get paid twice the rate...mmm.

The day the DOL starts prosecuting registered people for illegal installations and illegal COC's will be the day the electrical contractor will start charging a living wage. It is just too easy for any Jacob, Julius or Tutu to do electrical work and get away with it. No matter how much electrical contractors squeal at meetings and on social media nothing is going to change until all the contractors stand together and say F&^* it enough is enough, but until such time get smart and do what the Africans do in Africa, who cares about earthing a couple plugs, it means less profit because you have to use an earth wire.

**ians** · 19-Dec-13, 07:50 AM

Elect 1, I had the same issue when I went to the DOL, they don't even have a copier, clearly the office is just a front to make money. Ask yourself a simple question in Durban they are located in a small poky office in most expensive building in Durban...The Royal hotel. makes you think doesn't it ? I was told to go to the post office. The reason they don't have a copier is because I don't think the person who is taught step by step what to do knows how to use a copier, not part of his job description.

I got a person to call someone else in the same building who gave them a bullshit stories to allow me to get a copy done in another department, went down 2 floors and got my copies and had them certified by the same person who did the copies for me.

It is a scam.

**ians** · 19-Dec-13, 07:57 AM

The department of labour has proved that all electrical contractors are a bunch of idiots who are so gullible that they will even pay a fee to some department which has absolutely no powers to enforce any laws, not only because they are incompetent and uneducated but because they actually don't have the manpower to enforce any of the laws they try make you abide by. So what they do is give one of the contractors powers and let them fight with each other. Mark Palmer come to mind...so does AIA and so forth.

I cant believe (or should I can say) that there is over 1000 contractors out there allowing a small minority of people dictate to them, so long as you bend over and allow it, it will just become like the etoll, shut up and pay.

**Yuri** · 19-Dec-13, 08:10 PM

I had a nice chat with Nico van den Berg the AIA in gauteng. He told me that the proses to become a AIA is so difficult that only 3 guys have dun it. The other thing is that thy can only inspect properties that the owner or DOL gave them permission to inspect

**ians** · 20-Dec-13, 07:35 AM

And to make it worse the customer has to pay for the investigation, then pay for the repairs and then sue for his money, how many people would actually be that stupid to call the DOL or AIA and waste their money, it is cheaper just to get it fixed yourself.

The electrical industry requires a major revamp and the first person to go should be who ever is running the DOL. Enforcing the law and arresting responsible people and contractors for illegal installations would be a move in the right direction it would make people think twice before they rush out and drop some unskilled staff member on site to wire up an electrical installation, more responsible people would be monitoring the installations and the general rate would increase because the you would be quoting apples for apples and not apples for peanuts. I can tell you it would only take one or two R100K fines or 6 months in jail and the industry would turn in a matter of days. Electrical Contractors and all these illegal operators like gate, aircon, electric fence who carry out installations would be very nervous to take out a screwdriver and interfere with any electrical installation.

**ELECT 1** · 20-Dec-13, 03:00 PM

Originally Posted by ians

And to make it worse the customer has to pay for the investigation, then pay for the repairs and then sue for his money, how many people would actually be that stupid to call the DOL or AIA and waste their money, it is cheaper just to get it fixed yourself.

The electrical industry requires a major revamp and the first person to go should be who ever is running the DOL. Enforcing the law and arresting responsible people and contractors for illegal installations would be a move in the right direction it would make people think twice before they rush out and drop some unskilled staff member on site to wire up an electrical installation, more responsible people would be monitoring the installations and the general rate would increase because the you would be quoting apples for apples and not apples for peanuts. I can tell you it would only take one or two R100K fines or 6 months in jail and the industry would turn in a matter of days. Electrical Contractors and all these illegal operators like gate, aircon, electric fence who carry out installations would be very nervous to take out a screwdriver and interfere with any electrical installation.

Ian ,
Good point and i agree with you.

But we have to make the COC easier and user friendly, and what i mean is, if you replace a plug, a coc is required, then make a more simplified form.

**Sparks** · 21-Dec-13, 01:50 AM

Like I said previously, Re-instate the old onbudsmen. Let DOL appoint them as accredited AIA. Oops, AIA may not operate as electrical contractors! However, if they were put on retainer by DOL, they would not need to! They had the clout, give it back to them, they got results! Let them do the weeding out of these idiots with papers but no knowledge! The "onbudsman" of times gone by in Port Elizabeth was a worthy gentleman who had a damn good reputation among honest law-abiding contractors. I salute you Mr Rod Trower. I knew I could rely on you to take these bums, who have taken the industry down the drain, to book.
Following protocol gets you nowhere! I can prove it, anyone wants the proof they can request it from me. AIA report, DOL report, even email from the Senior Prosecutor stating that at that time he only had 1(one) case, the idiot then supplied the same number of the case which I queried stating that he had no knowledge of it despite it being his only case!

**ELECT 1** · 21-Dec-13, 06:37 AM

Maybe the DOL are the wrong people to manage the electrical industry.
WE need a dedicated electrical body to control and supervise, some one that the contractor can go to as a friend and consult.
A body that can investigate, make decisive and instant non biased decisions and apply.
We have the ECA, but no teeth when it comes to dealing with this stuff.

**Yuri** · 21-Dec-13, 07:38 AM

Originally Posted by ians

And to make it worse the customer has to pay for the investigation, then pay for the repairs and then sue for his money, how many people would actually be that stupid to call the DOL or AIA and waste their money, it is cheaper just to get it fixed yourself.

The electrical industry requires a major revamp and the first person to go should be who ever is running the DOL. Enforcing the law and arresting responsible people and contractors for illegal installations would be a move in the right direction it would make people think twice before they rush out and drop some unskilled staff member on site to wire up an electrical installation, more responsible people would be monitoring the installations and the general rate would increase because the you would be quoting apples for apples and not apples for peanuts. I can tell you it would only take one or two R100K fines or 6 months in jail and the industry would turn in a matter of days. Electrical Contractors and all these illegal operators like gate, aircon, electric fence who carry out installations would be very nervous to take out a screwdriver and interfere with any electrical installation.

Nico told me if he is called out by a privet person (almost always new home owners ) he inspects the installation and gives the contractor 14 days to fix it. If the contractor is not willing to do it he starts the steps to revoke the contracters wiremens licence

In all he's years as a AIA he has only started to revoke one persons wiremans licence
I have even seen his test tool bag he even puts tape in there. If a contractor has not taped a blue nutral wire black....