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Thread: Violence in our schools

  1. #1
    Diamond Member Vanash Naick's Avatar
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    Violence in our schools

    The Glenvista High incident is just one of many involving children in schools in South Africa today…


    I thought of this from a completely different perspective. The perspective that a child is now subject to a different legislation which has been in force since 1 April 2010 namely the Child Justice Act 75 of 2008.

    The brainchild to prevent a child from the harsh exposure to the criminal justice system and if the child accepts responsibility a prosecutor may now implement a diversion option which in terms of the act is a diversion of a matter involving a child away from the formal court procedures in a criminal matter. The child has to be assessed by a probation officer who should be a social worker to report on the child’s age, education, circumstances. This report must be handed to a prosecutor with the idea that a child should not go to prison but can be dealt with in our legal justice system in a different manner with the purpose of reintergrating these children back into society. The child’s parent is paramount in all these decisions. There are many diversion options and they include: this is for a schedule one offence such as common assault:
    Oral or written apology, Formal caution with or without conditions,Placement under supervision and guidance order; reporting order; compulsory school attendance order; family time order; peer association order; good behaviour order; an order prohibiting the child from visiting, frequenting or appearing in specified places;Referral to counselling or therapy;Compulsory attendance of vocational, educational or therapeutic programmes;Symbolic restitution;Restitution of a specific object;Community service; Provision of some service or benefit by the child to the victim; orPayment of compensation.



    The issue for me is that we live in a very violent society, many of our strikes are violent and these strikers have children and a community from which they come. So if kids are happening to watch tv and see their very own parents engaged in violent strikes, that proportion of kids are likely to behave similiarly when dealing with issues. The community has crime and other socio-economic issues. These children will therefore be a product of this community and you should expect them to behave in such violent and irrational behaviour. I therefore respect that a child is prosecuted differently to an adult.


    Assault: Regardless of whether a child assaults a teacher or a teacher assaults a child the offence remains assault for both the teacher and child. The only difference is that the child is criminally processed and dealt with differently from adults. So if assault and the grammar of violence are so prevalent in our very society with armed criminals engaging in sorts and manners of crimes in a poverty stricken environment where kids don’t have decent facilities geared at a kid’s welfare, you bound to have violence
    Last edited by Vanash Naick; 09-Oct-13 at 04:57 AM. Reason: typo
    “The philosophers have only interpreted the world, in various ways. The point, however, is to change it.” Karl Marx
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    Diamond Member tec0's Avatar
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    I think we are going to see a lot more violence/abuse before action will be taken I am sorry to say.
    peace is a state of mind
    Disclaimer: everything written by me can be considered as fictional.

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    Diamond Member adrianh's Avatar
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    What school kids need is this:

    a good snot klap
    How easily someone is offended is directly proportional to how stupid they are.
    ~GS Elevator

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    Platinum Member sterne.law@gmail.com's Avatar
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    Unfortunately the issue of human rights sometimes loses focus.
    Yes, children have the right to education, yes kicking them out of school would be counter productive, but we can't have people doing what they want.
    It's a tricky balancing act, but quality education is the absolute key.
    Anthony Sterne

    www.acumenholdings.co.za
    DISCLAIMER The above is merely a comment in discussion form and an open public arena. It does not constitute a legal opinion or professional advice in any manner or form.

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    Gold Member Dave S's Avatar
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    = ...but quality education is the absolute key.
    ...and parents that actually do give a damn...
    Last edited by IanF; 09-Oct-13 at 07:45 AM. Reason: fixed quote
    Today Defines Tomorrow
    Errare Humanum Est Remitto Divinus

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    Diamond Member Vanash Naick's Avatar
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    There’s yet another way to see this: The criminal whomsoever he or she may be has other roles to play in society such as father, mother, brother, sister, son, daughter etc. As such the criminals children will also see what their parents are engaging in and tragically in many cases they pick up certain qualities.

    If you move away from the ‘strikers,’ scenario, then we also have communities riddled with drug abuse and all the ills that may come of it.
    The kids in these neighbourhoods such as the Cape Flats pick up on this ethos of gangsterism, drug dealing and use and the list goes on. They do have schools, a proportion of these parents(the drug lords and users) will take this behavior right into their very own classroom. This places the teacher and the rest of the students in a predicament.

    The grammar of violence, possible drug use, possible domestic violence prevalence, possible heated custody battles and poverty will manifest in our schools. It just has to unless the root of these problems are properly addresses.

    The Child Justice Act takes into consideration that every child offender comes from a community and has different circumstances. So though what that child done was wrong, it was assault, he will be dealt with under a different legislation.

    To compound matters, you have some teachers who are pedophiles and abuse children. This element of an adult criminal can’t also be ignored
    Last edited by Vanash Naick; 09-Oct-13 at 09:17 AM.
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    Diamond Member adrianh's Avatar
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    The country lacks discipline. The lack of discipline filters down from the very top of government right through to the schools. Monkey see monkey do!
    How easily someone is offended is directly proportional to how stupid they are.
    ~GS Elevator

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    Email problem KimH's Avatar
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    Agree with Adrianh on both points.

    Lack of discipline leads to moral decay - ultimately people need rules, without them they are just lost.
    There's way too much molly coddling and far too little consequence these days.
    "If at first you don't succeed, do it like your mother told you."

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    Diamond Member adrianh's Avatar
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    Remember the kid that sets the young lady teacher's hair on fire in Cape Town. When I was at school you knew very well not to do anything like that because your a$$ would burn for a long time. We used to get anything from 1 to 6 canings on our a$$es for doing badly in tests let alone assaulting a teacher.

    They need to bring back corporal punishment in schools and the police should also hand out good hidings in public.

    I'm all for good hidings giving in public on a Saturday afternoon so that everybody gets to see that punishment is swift and harsh. No more time wasted in counts and full jails, just give them a good hiding and send them on their way!
    How easily someone is offended is directly proportional to how stupid they are.
    ~GS Elevator

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    Diamond Member Vanash Naick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrianh View Post
    Remember the kid that sets the young lady teacher's hair on fire in Cape Town. When I was at school you knew very well not to do anything like that because your a$$ would burn for a long time. We used to get anything from 1 to 6 canings on our a$$es for doing badly in tests let alone assaulting a teacher.

    They need to bring back corporal punishment in schools and the police should also hand out good hidings in public.

    I'm all for good hidings giving in public on a Saturday afternoon so that everybody gets to see that punishment is swift and harsh. No more time wasted in counts and full jails, just give them a good hiding and send them on their way!
    Here’s the thing we’ve got laws in place and a criminal justice system that functions to a greater or lesser extent.

    The offence is in question, regardless of where it took place and by whom it was inflicted upon, is common assault. So the child in question will attend a preliminary hearing where a diversion option can be recommended. The child will just be tried under different conditions from an adult. A teacher too, as the media shows can also be an assailant who assaults a child either physically or sexually.

    We’ve seen Professors been fired for allegations of rape and sexual assault and sexual harassment.

    There are laws in place. The issue of corporal punishment was already dealt with by the constitutional court in a case which involved a bunch of Christian Schools who brought an application stating that if they collectively consent to the corporal punishment of their very own children in a selected number of schools and the schools endorse the principle, corporal punishment should be allowed. The application failed dismally in the constitutional court. The CC is always guided by the constitution itself and in particular fundamental rights. The child’s right to safety and security, right to a safe environment, right to dignity and respect, right not to be subjected to inhumane or degrading punishment trumped the Christian organisation’s right to collectively consent to corporal punishment which is in actual fact assault.

    I wouldn’t have a clue as to how the school itself as an organization with a principal and parents governing body could sanction the assault of their children and more specifically a bunch of other children who don’t share the same ethos.
    This is a tricky one.

    This child in the Glenvista high saga wherever he may be right now, he is regretting what he’s done and now just wants normality and stability to come to his teenage life. The courts recognize this. The pivotal issue is whether the child freely and voluntary before a prosecutor acknowledges responsibility and the his parent’s consent to a diversion program such as vocation school and therapy , the court can then immediately dispense with the matter and have it diverted.





    “The philosophers have only interpreted the world, in various ways. The point, however, is to change it.” Karl Marx
    vanash.naick@gmail.com
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