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Thread: E-tolling or E Thief?

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    Diamond Member Vanash Naick's Avatar
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    E-tolling or E Thief?

    According to Dr Roelof Botha you will only be saving in many ways when you are in essence tolled. In fact according to him you will even be able to generate R8.84 for every rand that you spend! There are other benefits as well, you’ll save so much time that you’ll be able to spend more time with your family!
    Here’s where Dr Botha’s spin goes horribly wrong. You are currently using those very roads that you will be charged for using at a later date. You using those roads now, only you not currently paying anything! Do you find that you currently have more time to spend with your family? You find that you spending less time in the traffic? Since you using the very same roads that you will be paying for using in the near future, are you currently making R8.84 rand just for using the roads for nothing at the moment?
    The only difference going forward is that you will be paying for using the very same roads that you are currently using without paying anything! So how on earth will you be saving or how on earth will this be beneficial to you when you were paying nothing for using these roads yesterday and today you paying something? There is no way this logic will work with South Africans.
    This is his exact words:
    "Go to the trouble of calculating the time that you are likely to save, or probably are already saving, by using the Gauteng Freeway Improvement Project as opposed to if it had never occurred, and take that time saving and place a value on it in terms of what you can earn if you were to be productive or how fit you could become if you go to the gym or maybe improving the relationships with the rest of your family and spending more time with them."
    Dr Botha we are using the very same roads today that we will be paying for tomorrow and there’s no added benefit. The only difference is that we will be paying for using these roads going forward. Nothing you say makes any sense. How do you go from a situation of not paying anything at all for driving on these very same roads to a situation where tomorrow you pay for using these very same roads???How can you save when all the trucks that transport consumer goods will be paying tolls? It's common sense that this will cause the price of food to go up!!!
    Last edited by Vanash Naick; 07-Apr-12 at 08:35 AM.
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    Diamond Member adrianh's Avatar
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    Come on, now you're spinning it it the opposite direction. He is simply saying that the money that was spent to upgrade the roads saves you time and money. Sanrail is trying to get somebody to foot the bill.
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    Diamond Member Blurock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrianh View Post
    Come on, now you're spinning it it the opposite direction. He is simply saying that the money that was spent to upgrade the roads saves you time and money. Sanrail is trying to get somebody to foot the bill.
    and the profits are being paid to a company in Austria in stead of a fund to maintain the roads.
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    Diamond Member Vanash Naick's Avatar
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    Here’s my gripe with economists in general: Despite the litany of things an economist can say, to date they unable to solve the problem of unlimited human needs with limited resources. They unable to solve unemployment problems, they fail dismally in solving the problem with famine. The leading economists failed to forecast the global economic crisis and take proactive steps to prevent such a crisis. So, please enlighten me, why exactly do we have economists? What is it that they in actual fact do that is beneficial? If you a mechanic by profession you should be able to a fix a car, if you an economists you should be able to fix the economy. Compiling reports and saying that this study or the other reveals a certain set of facts that can be disputed by other economists helps nothing and no one. Besides in general economists are not unanimous on the main economic issues. They all have different opinions!
    According to Dr Botha, you’ll either be able to generate R8.84 for every rand you spend on etolling or you’ll be able to save money and/or time. Now here’s where this logic really does fail. You are currently driving past all the Sanrail structures, it’s only that when you drive past these structures and effectively use that road you not e charged or e tolled, you don’t pay anything. So by implication if you’ll be able to generate R8.84 for every rand you spend on etolling then how much more can you save or generate now when you are paying nothing?
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    Diamond Member Justloadit's Avatar
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    So Vanash, according to the economists, we should have more money in the bank cos of the savings we are having currently by not having to pay eTolls yet.

    Well you know what, I aint seen it, in fact the balance gets lower every month.

    What a load of bull they feed us.
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    Diamond Member Vanash Naick's Avatar
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    Absolutely, in fact, they provide that when you do actually start paying for every rand that you spend on etolling you'll either make or save R8.84. You will be put in such a nice position that you'll have more time to spend with your family and even some more time for the gym.
    From what is out there publically many are saving that you'll pay about R600 per month. I don't know how accurate this is. If we assume that you do pay R600 per month and we accept the savings formulae then you essentially making R5304 or saving R5304 per month. In principal I'm not completely against pay a toll on the basis that monies will be used maintain and improve the infrastructure. I am soley against the amounts of money we'll be charged. They should charge everybody a flat rate of R50 per month. Eventually they'll make the money spent on the roads.
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    Diamond Member adrianh's Avatar
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    I am watching a rerun of 3rd degree debate on etolling between Dr Botha & Vavi. I must agree with Vanash, the spin is absolutely absurd. The good doctor is unable to quantify the R8.. figure and all he does is refer back to his 'so called' study without showing how that figure was derived.

    Ok, I concede, the good doctor is smoking his socks.
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    Diamond Member Vanash Naick's Avatar
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    The tragic turn of events for us as South African's is the clear message we getting from Government i.e. Pay or else.! So this will be a grudge payment, which we really don't want to make but becuase of the consequences of not paying, everyone will pay...
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    Diamond Member wynn's Avatar
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    Just out of curiosity, how much does an articulated vehicle carrier pay and would it pay to ride onto the back of one at the beginning of and roll off at the end of the toll you use???

    I smell a business opportunity!!!
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    Diamond Member Vanash Naick's Avatar
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    You exactly right with the business opportunity! Since there are economist out there that will argue that you'll save and/or generate R8.84 for every rand you spend on etolling, then I have a business/investment offer for you! Any economist can simply buy my etolling package, i.e. they pay my monthly etolling fee and in return they get to save and/or generate R8.84!! How can you turn this opportunity down and for good measure I'll also throw in some extra minutes for you to spend at the gym!
    “The philosophers have only interpreted the world, in various ways. The point, however, is to change it.” Karl Marx
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